So, my good friend (18m) had a falling out with his ex (19m) because the ex bullied him and also because he is apparently dating a 16f, so my friend thinks he is a pedophile for obvious reasons (adult + minor).
I can see why this would be considered bad but also, when I turn 16, my girlfriend will be 19 too, as I am currently a young sophomore who is about 3 years younger than her girlfriend, a senior.
Grey area. The suggestion that it’s pedophilia is silly given they’re close in age, but a 3-4 year age gap when someone is 16 can be pretty significant; I’d consider it a warning sign.
Not pedophilia since not prepubescent.
In the medical sense a therapist treating someone for pedophilia would use the term, you’re correct. In a colloquial sense, Epstein was a pedophile.
Definitely a warning sign. It really depends on the specifics because people mature at different rates, but there’s a much higher chance of it being problematic. There’s the half your age plus 7 rule, but it doesn’t really work if you are under 22.
Yeah, my first boyfriend had been jumped up two grades, so I was 16 and he was 14. It never went beyond awkward kissing in the alley after class tho.
There’s the half your age plus 7 rule, but it doesn’t really work if you are under 22.
Doesn’t it?
- 14/2+7 = 14. It’s questionable for anybody under 14 to be in a romantic or sexual relationship even if the other person is the exact same age.
- 16/2+7 = 15. People tend to mature rapidly in this age range, so dating someone much younger is sketchy.
- 18/2+7 = 16.
- 20/2+7 = 17.
These line up with my intuition for the age gap being acceptable, not something that should raise eyebrows. A little outside that becomes a warning sign. A lot outside that is almost certainly abusive.
21 and 17 can be a big gap, even 20 and 17 can be. It’s not as clear cut as 22, which can also be sketchy but is at least recognized as fully legal everywhere. I think there’s too much diversity in maturity and life experience at those young ages, the potential for issues increases so those kinds of relationships are inherently concerning in ways that relationships involving legal adults are not. I’m not saying they are inherently problematic, but if you know people with that kind of age gap you should be looking out for the underage person to ensure they aren’t being taken advantage of.
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social justice warriors
Okay boomer.
If you were 22 and they were 25 no one would care. It’s 3 years.
Try moving that in the other direction though; I expect you’ll eventually find pairing that makes you uncomfortable.
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If it really was a 4-year-old dating a 7-year-old, I unironically feel like that would be more comfortable, probably because “dating” between little children is kind of silly in my mind.
Overall, my take would probably be “An adult who deliberately gets into a relationship with a minor (like the friend’s ex) is kind of weird, while an established couple with a 3-year age gap (like Jessica/Vitor herself) is fine.”
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The difference in age between 22 and 25 is a lot less than between 19 and 16.
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The same numerically. You’re not that obtuse, so is this a joke or are you a cringey debatelord?
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Doubling down on feigned obtuseness, I see.
You can take the girl out of Reddit, but can’t take the Reddit out of the girl.
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The age difference is about 20% smaller if you add 5 years. Development doesn’t happen linearly, though, so the difference is even bigger.
A 10 year age gap is the same numerically at age 40-50 as it is at age 10-20 but they are clearly vastly different. There’s an implicit power imbalance.
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I gave a more extreme example to demonstrate that your “they are the same numerically” idea is flawed
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Your critical thinking skills are somewhat lacking, I’m sorry to say
It’s the same numerically, like you said.
*age divided by two plus seven, round up with acknowledgments to experience gaps / power dynamics"/
“19 / 2 = 9.5 + 7 = 16.5” rounded is a plain seventeen.
His ex is in the wrong. Not even taking into account the experience gap between the two / power dynamics.
While I don’t know your specifics kid, I recommend taking some time to write down a few things:
- What you’re capable of versus what your older girlfriend is capable of.
- What are you able to provide versys what your older girlfriend is able to provide.
- What you give verus what you get.
The final advice is be careful of those older than you until you’re at least done with college.
Super creepy
As said, case by case situation. It’s an adult dating a minor, but sufficiently close in age to be waived, with several restrictions and close watch by all involved, especially family members.
The problem with age gaps isn’t age; it’s experience and power. Three years is still a big percentage of your life right now. In ten years time, three years will not be as significant a part of your life.
Think about how different you expect to be as a person in three years. Can you even realistically imagine who you will be?
As far as relationships - they work out when the people in them have common goals, and they fail- no matter how much love is in there- when the people involved are going in different directions in life. Part of your problem at your age is that the direction of your like is likely to change drastically over the coming years in ways you cannot anticipate.
Your answer right here, is why people need to think a little about age gaps. Like, I’ve heard and see people date where one is 21 years old and the other is like 32. Perfectly legal, however, that is a giant gap of this experience and power. The 32 year old will be in a considerably different worldview than the 21 year old and it’ll be completely jarring to function as a normal relationship.
I appreciate this answer, because it at least tries to reason from first principles. You can’t, imo, have this conversation without actually defining what we consider to be the problem.
I think the key concern is that age – particularly during teenage years – typically correlates with a power imbalance. And the concern is that the younger person could be exploited and/or suffer harm. However we need to remember:
- It’s possible for relationships to have a power imbalance and no one is harmed or looks back with regret.
- It’s possible for relationships between people of the same age to be very harmful/regretable.
So the questions I have are: how correlated is a specific age gap with severe harm? And what would we advise in this situation?
I think that a 16 year-old probably has around a 50% of getting badly hurt in a relationship with another 16 year-old, and probably a ~65% chance with a 19 year-old. Because a 19 year-old can probably manipulate a 16 year-old better than their peer, but they’re also presumably a bit more experienced and mature, which can be a good thing.
I’m making these predictions presuming that they’re sexually active, btw. Which I think is probable. But if they’re not, I think that the risks go down to around 10% chance in both cases. This is just my gut impression. So I’d just advise any 16 year-old in a relationship with a 19 year-old to move VERY slowly physically, and talk frequently to an older friend or sibling. And if your partner wants to do anything you’re uncomfortable talking about with your older friend or sibling, that’s a sign you shouldn’t do it.
If you follow that rule, I think 16 and 19 is no big deal. Because I really want to emphasize: a lot of the risk already exists when a 16 year-old dates someone their own age.
iffy to some, big maturity difference but romeo and juliet laws, i believe, say it’s fine.
In my experience, a 19yo male is as mature as a 16yo female… (Well, maybe, not always…)
A 16yo male would be significantly less mature than a 16yo female…
What I mean is that male and female mature differently and boys grow up later than girls. I would see as puzzling a 19yo female dating a 16yo male.
I feel like as long as they’re (the seniors) still in school, then it should be fine.
I personally know someone that almost this exact situation has happened to.
So A) depending on the state or country’s age of consent and/or Romeo-juliet exceptions, their may or may not be anything legally disallowed by a 16 year old dating and being sexually active with a 19 year old or older.
B) It certainly doesn’t get more morally wrong in your situation where you’re already seeing someone 3 years older than you, as you get older. That difference only becomes less significant as you age.
C) If the age of consent or Romeo-juliet laws do not make a carve out for your situation, and you were dating and sexually active when they were 17 then likely your partner would’ve already been breaking the law before they were an adult. The difference now is that they’d be tried as an adult if they were to be charged.
D) As for the question, is there actually anything wrong with it. In the vast majority of cases, yes, there is something wrong about it, objectively. But also, it’s not necessarily a big problem in the end, sometimws. The problem comes down to three things. 1) Generally speaking, people your age lack real world insight into adulthood and adult relationships and struggle to make mature, rational, long-term-thinking decisions without the overwhelming power of novelty and emotion that comes with young love. I don’t say that to be insulting, just call it the wisdom of hindsight. We were all, to some degree, still kids at your age, and made stupid decisions that many of us regret. That is something an older partner should be cognizant of too, when they are receiving your consent to sexual acts, that your lack of experience means you may not fully appreciate what you are consenting to. 2) Even if you are mature, understand your decisions, and consent with the full understanding and appreciation of what that consent means, the relationship will almost necessarily have an unhealthy imbalance. They being adults typically means that they have more money, more freedom, and more control over the relationship. Truly healthy adult relationships are a partnership been coequal people. 16 year olds are still kids and typically still the responsibility of parents or guardians, still in school, still responsible only for a small fraction of their own care. And many at that age see older partners as a way to jump the line and soup ahead to becoming adults early, but it doesn’t work like that. 3) Even if it is legal, there is a stigma (and not a wholly unjustified one) that your partner will face that you will not. And if it’s not legal, there’s an even huger risk to your partner, losing their freedom, having their name in a sec offense registry, struggling to find homes or jobs, that again, you don’t face. That’s not fair and it’s simply not a good idea and it’s a risk to both partners.
But like I said, it’s not necessarily all that bad. It could be legal, mature, fully consentual, coequal, and neither partner suffers due to the relationship. And it can workout long term. But I do gotta warn you, that is definitely not the norm.
At those ages its tough. I have a friend who secretly started dating his wife when she was in junior high while he was in high school. Once she was 18 they officially started dating for a year then did the one year engagement and then got married to be all proper but they had known each other for like half a decade or more before the official thing. Have not hung around with them for awhile but from facebook they still seem to be married and their kids are getting pretty old. Ultimately he is only like 4 years older than her and something which if your talking 18 and 22 is no big deal but 18 and 14 gets real weird.
16-19? Not pedophilia. Not literally nor legally, move on.
Pedophilia means being attracted by somebody who does not show sexual maturity yet, and I strongly doubt that I the case (I have a 16yo daughter, so…). And laws, usually, have clear exceptions for similar ages people like this, as it’s expected and quite normal. I mean given how stupid males are at that age, he being 3y older alny means they are closer than two 16yo.
Are they both in school? Is there some power imbalance or abuse? Otherwise, move on and let them live their lives.
It’s not literally pedophilia, cool, but it is still creepy and child abuse
being 16 makes a 19 year old seem like a real adult
it wont end well, this situation probably means the younger party isn’t in a good place, some 19yo bozo isn’t in a position to support someone
I have no idea which part of the world you live, but here nothing of that is true most of the time.
That would be a love story between a first year and a last year student. Maybe unusual, but mostly doomed to last 3 months at best.
Indeed a 17-19 is more common, and 18-19 quite common, but I wouldnt worry too much. Monitor yes, specially if the 16yo is somebody I care for/of.
But child abuse? That’s a bit stretched.
a 4 year gap around that time is kind of a grey area, especially with high school kids. It’ll only be a problem if someone presses charges. It might do some psychological uncomfortable feelings for the younger one, but from what I’ve heard that’s a case-by-case basis.
Also local laws can vary from providence to providence. Like in the US the age of consent is 18 but there are some states that go as low as 16 on that front
America does not have a national age of consent; each state sets their own. It’s 16 in 30 states, 17 in nine states, and 18 in 11 states.
Yes, the age of consent is 16 in the majority of the USA.
Several of the states which set it at 17 or 18 also have close in age exemptions (AKA Romeo and Juliet laws) which cover the case that OP raises. In such cases, it is legal to have sex with somebody slightly below the age of consent as long as both people are sufficiently close in age; some states, such as Texas, also require them to have been dating since both were under the state age of consent. This means that, in most of America, it is perfectly legal for a 19-year-old to have sex with a 16-year-old.
The misunderstanding most likely comes from the fact that the majority of entertainment media is made in New York and California, where the age of consent is 18 with no exceptions, and pop culture writers act like this is the case everywhere.
Also I should clarify that bringing a minor across state limes to take advantage of a lower age of consent is a felony, for obvious reasons.
Yes it really is… I know when in High School you don’t get that , but once your removed from that isolated environment you will se it.
You don’t say what country you’re in, so I’ll assume you’re in my country. 16 is the age of consent so it’s totally fine from a legal perspective.
Whether it’s morally ok depends on the people involved. Are they similar maturity levels? Or is one taking advantage of the other’s immaturity?
Either way, it’s none of anyone’s business.
Not sure what country you’re in but if you’re 15 currently I’d be more concerned about your relationship. That is, if the legal age of consent is 16 as regardless of the morals around a relatively small age gap in the eyes of the law that is pedophilia. I anticipate your friend is OK seeming as his boyfriend is already at the age of consent.
A tangent: a 15yr old friend were caught getting frisky with their 15yr old boyfriend and they both got put on a sexual offenders list! Madness
