I was invited here to participate in discussion. But when I visit, all I see is a bunch of anti-tankie posts from a prolific anti-tankie, an Atlantic smear article about DSA from months ago, and a few genuinely good discussions. Let’s get those numbers up, and start drowning out the “based” memes.

As of today, the most divisive and urgent issue du jour, is about the government shutdown, and the legislative drama surrounding it. People are angry.

There are a lot of people directly affected by the shut down. I know someone who is basically working for free at her govt job because she’s scared she will lose her job completely. A department of 20 workers, reduced to a staff of 4 temporary slaves. She doubts she will get back pay, but hopes she will. Many of her coworkers will not. My friend doesnt think about it like that, but that is def one major pain point in the middle class.

I’m willing to bet the dem house legislature is just gonna fold with no healthcare demand, which is a seriously pressing issue for workers who rely on ACA.

Back of the napkin, about 45% of ACA recipients are at or below the poverty line. ACA subsidies cut off below 65k indiv/130k fam.

That bracket would include many government workers, except govt workers receive healthcare. 65k is like barely middle class in the US, with housing costs, soaring energy bills, etc.,

Interesting and tragic how the shut down is just a way to divide the working class over material issues, especially the working poor vs the middle class.

  • Juice@midwest.socialOPEnglish
    21·
    2 months ago

    What do you mean by pragmatic? You use the word a lot so you’re like referring to some philosophy? Its very politicized in every context ive seen it so I wonder what you mean, concretely.

    Also I’m not sure there is as much clarity around the commie/tankie distinction as you suppose. I had a convoy elsewhere here, the post with the Atlantic article, where someone was confused by what was meant by “the left of DSA,” they said it would all be ML, and I had to correct them. A lot of new socialists don’t realize that bring a Marxist- Leninist is distinct from being a Marxist and Leninist.

    How do you thread that needle? Because the online tankies are distinct from the many many good ML educators and organizers. I don’t agree with them on certain things, like rehabilitating Stalin, rejection of internationalism, and uncritical support of problematic socialist regimes. But I see people talking negatively about ML ideology, like about how they are infiltrators like some formless parasitic other. The memes don’t educate, they aren’t concrete, and I think they are troublesome for the left.

    When I see people more concerned with mischaracterizing some other, rather than doing practical work (and this doesnt mean you pers, we’ve talked about your work a little) I get a little worried. Listen I’m not saying start deleting these memes but they are legit the only memes, well maybe one exception. There are other political memes that would be actually educating, not just attacking some group that doesnt even come here. When people start associating Marxism and communism with these “tankies” because they don’t know all the history stuff but they can relate to being yelled at online for saying like, “isn’t Cuba a dictatorship,” then the tankie memes start to erode the basis for my work.

    Because even if we don’t like their immaturity, there is a lot of stuff I think they are closer to being right about than the average angry liberal. Or rather, the two sides sort of create each other, like I mentioned before, making eachnother more reactionary and provoked, deepening the worst behavior of both tendencies.

    • agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.worksMEnglish
      3·
      2 months ago

      I’m not referencing any specific philosophy, I’m using the dictionary definition:

      dealing with the problems that exist in a specific situation in a reasonable and logical way instead of depending on ideas and theories : practical as opposed to idealistic

      It is a direct response to impotent idealism. Leftist conversations on Lemmy eventually trend towards purity test circle jerks instead of actionable solutions. I want actionable solutions, actual praxis.

      When I see people more concerned with mischaracterizing some other, rather than doing practical work I get a little worried.

      Which is precisely the behavior we’re trying to counteract. The problematic instances are basically nothing but mischaracterizations of other leftists. It worries me that you’re bending over backwards to give these people the benefit of the doubt, but you seem to have problems when we call out specific interactions we’ve had with them.

      Their behavior is substantially more detrimental to your work than ours. They produce a constant stream of content that splinters the left, makes us look foolish, and presents leftist thought in a way that drives people away. If you haven’t experienced that personally, that’s nice for you, but it’s a way bigger problem than you’re making it out to be.

      EDIT: I just looked at all the posts, and I’m not sure what you see as a “mischaracterization”. Everything is either a screenshot of an actual conversation, or a commentary on an interaction I’ve either had personally, or is exactly identical to one I did. They’re not flattering depictions, true, but they’re not mischaracterizations. The real observed behavior they reference just isn’t flattering.