How do you guys actually learn how to fix certain things? Its mind boggling how one can visit a forum and there’s people saying “oh yeah just run -c xhhkrk ()<>[] bbbhjl and that will fix your sound issue”
Like WHERE do you even start? I hate having to look things up all the time when everyone else on windows “just works”. Copying commands off forums endlessly doesn’t really help you learn.
Example, installed cachyos on an older laptop, but sound and screen dimming will not work. I have no ides where to even begin with that. I feel like a windows user could at least poke around control panel and probably fix the issue but its way harder with linux.
I have had luck with almost everything working with mint on my desktop (except vr, oculus is a nighmare to get working) and have been running that about a year. If I had to set it all up again id have to re look up everything I forgot since then…
If there was something like man but easier to parse through, that would be immensely helpful. Like for my sound issue, if there was a better organized manual that I could look under “sound” and see the inner workings laid out and common issues, thats what we need. Otherwise people are going to be terrified of linux because its so hard.
From my experience, it’s something that only came with time spent diagnosing things, and then building up instincts for things like that, or just poking around with things and understanding how things work under the hood. Even then, there are usually things I have to look up every now and then.
Though I must admit, my knowledge basically tripled since installing arch and figuring things out myself with only the help of man pages, and trying to correct the behaviour of just looking things up and blindly applying fixes. Each time I need to fix something complicated, I fight the urge to just “look it up” and stop, take a breath, and think. It seems obvious but sometimes I forget to do that. I try to fix it myself, and then occasionally when shit hits the fan, I look it up, but try to understand why the fix works. But as I said, you will likely only reach that level of experience with time, or alternatively throwing yourself into the deep end of a difficult distro with no hand holding to understand not only how something is done, but why.
Not sure if any of that made sense, or I’m just rambling… Eh…
arch wiki. some of their documentation is better then most apps give
Interesting.
I kind of have the opposite impression. I really enjoy being able to look things up like you mentioned. I have really enjoyed being on Linux in general for about two years or so now and I wish I’d switched much sooner. I really appreciate the willingness to help from the community and usually any issue I run into is a quick and easy fix. I don’t think there’s been a single thing I’ve asked about that was super difficult or I was unable to be helped with. Even if I don’t understand the technical aspects, it’s nice to have a collective resource essentially. Nobody’s ever been mean or talked down to me over any of it. Positive experiences all around.
You guys are awesome, truly.
The crew is great, I agree!
Its just frustrating having to search how to do something so simple while bob on windows 11 just presses his volume button to get sound working. Makes me feel like wasting time on linux is stupid. But I enjoy using it. It just takes a lot of time and sometimes I ask why am I even doing this.
For sure, it can definitely be a bit quirky sometimes and requires some perseverance. Bluetooth/sound issues do seem to be one of the more common frustrations.
Convenience isn’t worth complacency though. I’d much rather keep my values of freedom, privacy, morality, etc. than to ever consider letting Microsoft get away with whatever they want to. Nobody should be accepting of their behavior.
The next time you encountered a problem, and found the command to fix that problem, call in sick for a week, drill all the way down to the source code level, find out what the root cause was, and what that command does. You can only fix things if you know how it is supposed to work.
Hardcore user spotted
I study solutions given for some hours. If I can’t get their logic, I put them aside and go back in a few days, often after seeing something unrelated that helps understanding the topic I was stuck at. That I dunno if has a name, but I like to call it “additive learning”.
Also sudying =/= applying the solution
Same way you started anywhere: practice.
Most people who use Windows cant, and don’t, need to fix a thing. Same thing in Linux.
The goal is to make the OS as compatible with as many machines as possible, to make sure that user intervention isn’t really needed, so you don’t really get that reflexive sort of knowledge unless you’re doing it for work and being exposed to it at a MUCH larger scale. Even then, you forget the things you don’t use frequently.
There tons of learning simulators out there for the basics. Just found this one. Give it a go: https://itsfoss.gitlab.io/post/test-your-bash-skills-by-playing-command-line-games/
Ive actually played that one! However it doesn’t really help with amy real world issues unfortunately. Yeah, it makes sense that its really difficult to compile all of this information for all the hardware and distros etc. I feel like laptops have the most issues too
To be fair, you could play these games all day, and it still won’t register exactly what you’re doing because it lacks that repetition.
Try installing it across more machines and get some reps in that way:
- Maybe friends and family want to try it out
- Get a cheap VPS and host some basic services (not containers)
- Next time instead of installing a package for something you want to run, build from source
- Find a cheap laptop or two at a thrift store, garage sale, or Estate Sale you can beat on a bit
Having one machine working well just won’t get you the exposure you need. Identify some goal of anything you want working, and set about doing it the hard way.
-
https://www.learnlinux.tv/ - i started with this guy’s bash scripting series. learning bash will definitely give you at least a vague idea of what these forum commands are doing
-
i promote Codecademy every chance I get because they’ve got some really good free courses, and i actually subscribe to unlock the quizzes and projects. I went through the CompTIA Linux+ certification path last year and it covers a lot.
-
the most important part: take notes. like you said, there’s too much to remember. you gotta have a reference, even a place where you store other references. I use Obsidian, so i use that to search for a topic i may already have notes on already. each topic has links back to references (so many itsFOSS and GeeksForGeeks.org articles, but also youtube videos).
finally, a friendly warning: anytime a linux user uses the word “just” as in “just do this…” Ignore them. It’s never “just” something. this means they have lost the ability to put themselves in the shoes of a new user.
Haha oh yes, CRD also hates that word “just”. I probably say it myself too often too.
Good resources. Thank you
-
If you do something long enough, it then becomes second nature.
Monkey see monkey do is not understanding
I never said that.
Yeah, you look things up until they become memory. Or at least you learn what GNU app is going to give you what you need and then you use man pages.
I mostly know what I’m doing in Linux because I’ve been using it 30 years.
For something easier than man, check out tldr
I do have tealdeer!
man pages.
How do you search these to find relevant topics?
Example, “audio output”
it is just practise i guess. like we all start searching online, and then eventually keep on learning - oh my mic is clippin, but i turned my volume way down and it is still doing that - why would that be - and then remember that 1 have 2 audio related things in my system - 1 is pipewire for all user facing stuff, and then alsa (alsamixer) for actual hardware - and oh look - i had accidentally given an internal mic boost of 100%. it is not like i got to know that that is a thing in a dream, but over past 2-3 years of looking online, i know what are common culprits, and i also have learnt a bit about my system and how different things are done. when you know that, it is easier to look up a particular manpage or README
Learning resources are common. Good ones that go beyond ‘sudo yourmom’ are rare.
More approachable man pages sounds like a cool idea. Superman pages. It could not only have a list of flags but nested explanations of what those things mean. Maybe some wikipedia style markdown to connect it all. Simple English wikipedia writing style. Someone get on it. I don’t have time for any more projects.
2 things: Experience Repetition
First of all, continue to look up how to fix things, there’s no problem with that. HOWEVER, make sure you understand what the commands you are entering do. Same thing applies to Windows as well, I’ve seen plenty of troubleshooting posts that and with “paste these 3 lines into power shell”
The more you do this, you’ll get a feel for how everything is organized. You might not know HOW to fix your issue at this point, but you will at least know where to look for logs and where to find the config files relevant to your issue. Once you’ve fixed enough problems, you’ll start to be able to figure it out on your own. You can also help out with bug reports better now too.
You also need to do this often enough that you remember these things. I’ve got a bunch of Linux installations (3 desktops, 1 laptop, 4 small servers) so I get plenty of practice changing things. When I only had the 1 computer running Linux, it was a lot harder to remember everything.
This is why suggesting distros like CachyOS to beginners is dumb. I know everyone wants to promote their own favourite, but then this is what happens.
Stick to the big names, having large userbases helps them stomp out these bugs.
I actually tried mint first on it and everything worked, but is a spare laptop im playing around with so I didnt mind
Time. And experience.
I compare this with other skills like growing plants… “keep watering them” is not good advice for cacti…
A lot of Windows users have to search for solutions which you probably know. And there’s still advice out there to “open regedit…” (do you understand the difference between HKLM and HKCU?)
Windows is like Linux, but someone’s taken away all choice: 1 desktop GUI, 1 filesystem (mostly), etc. so there’s usually only 1 answer.
Pressing the volume key should work as it’s been the same for decades. Yet, why can’t I move the taskbar to the top of the screen in Win11 now?
You’ll get there with Mint Cinnamon, but someone else on Mint Xfce will have to do something different, and learn different things yet you’ll still both learn about
apteven if you try to only use the gui to update your systems.Over time the venn diagram of advice becomes clearer and you find what advice works for you (ie cli vs gui) and you learn why some plants need water and others don’t.
Program -h or --help
Or just look for help outright online. No one’s holding a gun against your head.
