I mean, it really depends on what the job is. A friend of mine is a pulmonary surgeon and he’s worked a few late nights precisely because he wanted someone else to get to go home to their kids.
I do think the work culture in western countries has a habit of losing sight of what real labor is supposed to accomplish. It shouldn’t just be a grind. It doesn’t have to just be about maximizing profit. You can do work to make your corner of the world a better place. And you can be enthusiastic about your job such that - 20 years from now - your kids will remember what you did fondly even if you weren’t by their side as often as you’d like.
FFS, in a truly good and proper society, they’d be by your side because we wouldn’t be tediously segregating the working world from the living world. Anyone know why every office building and work site doesn’t have a daycare built in?
A few late nights here and there is perfectly fine! Heck, even my wife stayed a little late at the zoo sometimes to get stuff done. The main point of the post is glorifying overworking vs necessary overworking. It’s sometimes “necessary” in software to work a few late nights, but it should be FAR from the norm. Hell, my old manager used to let us order DoorDash on the company dime if we had to work a few hours on a weekend to meet a deadline. I got fancy sushi!
I cannot think of a single time a software project requires any of that.
There is a insanely vast gap between the handful of jobs whose output literally save lives and grinding on a software project to hit a deadline. You’ve literally described the work ethic the post is cautioning against.
I’m saying meeting deadlines promised that can’t be pushed back, like you have to present at a conference or something. Sure, you or your manager should’ve planned better. But at least in my job when we “have” to work nights or weekends we get time off otherwise. We also have oncall rotations that need to have intervention at night if a dependency breaks or something.
At my work, if we work late we are forced to take the time back elsewhere. It gives the slack to deal with critical matters but without the toxic assumption that you must therefore miss out on your life.
I mean, it really depends on what the job is. A friend of mine is a pulmonary surgeon and he’s worked a few late nights precisely because he wanted someone else to get to go home to their kids.
I do think the work culture in western countries has a habit of losing sight of what real labor is supposed to accomplish. It shouldn’t just be a grind. It doesn’t have to just be about maximizing profit. You can do work to make your corner of the world a better place. And you can be enthusiastic about your job such that - 20 years from now - your kids will remember what you did fondly even if you weren’t by their side as often as you’d like.
FFS, in a truly good and proper society, they’d be by your side because we wouldn’t be tediously segregating the working world from the living world. Anyone know why every office building and work site doesn’t have a daycare built in?
A few late nights here and there is perfectly fine! Heck, even my wife stayed a little late at the zoo sometimes to get stuff done. The main point of the post is glorifying overworking vs necessary overworking. It’s sometimes “necessary” in software to work a few late nights, but it should be FAR from the norm. Hell, my old manager used to let us order DoorDash on the company dime if we had to work a few hours on a weekend to meet a deadline. I got fancy sushi!
I cannot think of a single time a software project requires any of that.
There is a insanely vast gap between the handful of jobs whose output literally save lives and grinding on a software project to hit a deadline. You’ve literally described the work ethic the post is cautioning against.
I’m saying meeting deadlines promised that can’t be pushed back, like you have to present at a conference or something. Sure, you or your manager should’ve planned better. But at least in my job when we “have” to work nights or weekends we get time off otherwise. We also have oncall rotations that need to have intervention at night if a dependency breaks or something.
Deadlines can always be set with reasonable timeframe, and despite what they tell you they can always be pushed back
Someone dying on the OR table cannot.
A child who needs food cannot.
A burning building cannot wait.
At my work, if we work late we are forced to take the time back elsewhere. It gives the slack to deal with critical matters but without the toxic assumption that you must therefore miss out on your life.
Are you hiring?
I ain’t doxxing myself, sorry