If I was on Patreon I’d tell them to pull the app. Fuck em they have a website.
Right? You’d think Patreon would throw their weight against Apple, as this is clearly not in their best interest. Threaten to pull the app, and if Apple follows through, they get nothing. Alternatively, move payments entirely outside of the app and force Apple to either do something which is guaranteed to be extremely unpopular, or call their bluff. But they won’t do these things or even try to negotiate Apple’s cut.
Apple may appear to swing the biggest dick here, but I am so disgusted by these weak companies just immediately bending over without a fight.
As always, it’s the creators who will be faced with hardship, but neither entity seems to give a shit.
Is It better for patreon to lose 30% of income from Apple pay, or to have Apple users not being able to pay unless they open the webpage and pay from there? Is it better for them to remove the app altogether and have users on Apple forced to use it through the website?
I’d imagine they’d lose quite a bit of subscriptions if they did that. Is that more or less than 30% is something I don’t know.
Is it better for them to remove the app altogether and have users on Apple forced to use it through the website?
Yes. Clearly yes, for everyone. This sort of shit only continues because people don’t do that.
I would imagine this would lead to having less users. Or people that use it less. It would also make the experience for users worse. As such it would lead to less subscriptions. It is not clear to me that this would be better. I’m not sure on whether it would be worse, but I doubt it’d be better for everyone.
Didn’t they just lose a lawsuit along these lines? I can’t imagine this going well for them.
I fucking hate mega corps. It’s never fucking enough… Ever… Apple has more money than some countries yet these assholes want ever more…
Tax all these assholes into oblivion!
“Don’t hate the player, hate the game.” – Karl Marx
I reserve the right to hate apple regardless, thank you.
I agree, but don’t let it distract you from how much capitalism sucks balls comrade
The game is made up of dipshit players mostly working against their own interests.
I had no idea Apple was so desperate for money
One way, or another, that revenue stream will go to shit, they’re just doing a smash and grab while they can.
3.78 Trillion dollar market cap. You don’t get to that valuation by being generous to your customers. Apple is as capitalist as any of them. They’re just wrapped in shiny marketing. Now only if their fans understood that.
Damn! Creators are going to need another Patreon to supplement their Apple-induced Patreon shortfall.
Apple users BTFO
Sadly, I’m guessing this is transparent to iOS users, they think they’re supporting creators with $X each month, but behind the scenes, the creator is getting $X * 0.7 and then I’m guessing Patreon also takes some off the top of that for their infrastructure.
This is why you can’t subscribe to Spotify or Netflix or a ton of other services through the app store apps, they aren’t gonna give up 30% revenue. Patreon is going to be the same eventually, creators will take it as a last resort, but they’ll absolutely scream “go to the website to donate to me,” or maybe even disable iOS app contributions.
Kind of like how the nonprofits I’ve been part of have to pay a CC processing fee which varies by processor and card, so they don’t accept AMEX or Discover cards, and then stress “please send us a check instead,” and if a donation is over a certain amount, they won’t accept it by CC at all. If you’re going to donate $30k or $100k or more, no fucking way are we giving thousands of dollars to a processor. Write us a check, we’ll accept it in person, and take a photo of us fellating you, suitable for framing.
These Silicon Valley parasites are taking way more than a fair share. Every industry is Consolidated and the few gatekeeping corporations left take more than their fair share that is the entire problem. Capitalism does not work without controls. Never has, never will. This absolute free market talk has always been ad hoc, to further the business interests of those making the arguments.
What exactly does Apple think that they’re brining to the equation in order to deserve that 30? Is it simply that they’re hosting an app on their store, so therefore they’re entitled to a cut?
So if I write a novel, and get it published, Microsoft can say "We deserve 30% because you used our product to produce your product?
I’m so fucking tired of corporations. It’s well past guillotine-o-clock.
What exactly does Apple think that they’re brining to the equation in order to deserve that 30?
Because Valve can and Tim wants his yachts. No one is gonna stop em either. The App Store and Steam are the same thing: Store fronts that sell other peoples goods. You may say that Steam is just an app—don’t tell me, tell your representatives
Which device only allows you to run software downloaded from Steam?
You may say that Steam is just an app—don’t tell me, tell your representatives
Tell your representatives, not me. According to our representatives, what Apple has is not a monopoly. You don’t have to convince me, you have to convince them. If you truly care about this issue, vote accordingly.
Why are you booing them, they’re right.
There is a vocal subset of people on the Fediverse who truly believe that Steam, Valve, and Gabe can no do wrong. Completely, forgetting that Valve and Gabe are both worth billions of dollars. That Steam fits the legal defintion of a monopoly because Steam controls such a massive part of the market.
I was talking to the people downvoting, the comment was in the negative at the time I typed mine
It’s a little different though. Valve is providing the actual platform, and running it. Apple doesn’t own Patreon, they simply host a client.
It sure is different, but the people in charge dont know or care to know
They’re bringing the apple tax to the table
What exactly does Apple think that they’re brining to the equation in order to deserve that 30?
Apple users are some of the dumbest people on the planet. Most of them will gleefully support paying more to make the company richer.
Luckily I’m about to switch to graphene OS soon. I’ll be forced to make a bunch of changes to choices I made out of convenience in the past
Its the same with pretty much EVERY app on the apple store. Everything there is 30% more than the same thing bought elswhere
I’ve been warned many times in the past to not subscribe to people on the patreon app since it costs more then in browser because of the app store’s cut. So is this just even worse then it was or was that just for the google play store before?
Ya I always subscribe on the website. Google and Apple have both charged extra fees for monthly subscriptions bought within the app.
Why isn’t Apple trying to take 30% of all purchases through the Amazon app? Or eBay? Or your local grocery delivery? It’s the same exact thing. Such a stupid greedy fucking attempt
Next they’ll take 30% on every transaction through my banking app.
Iirc it has to do with “monthly subscriptions” and they are arguing that Patreon is a monthly subscription and those get charged at the higher amount.
It’s why subscribing to YouTube premium within iOS app costs more because Google just makes up the difference that way.
Not that’s it’s right but it’s really debatable if Patreon should be considered a monthly subscription the same way streaming services are.
I think they’re trying to kill Patreon for some reason. Maybe they’ll launch their own Patreon competitor? Maybe they noticed developers were giving away iOS apps and getting crowdfunded on Patreon?
Because Patreon creators can’t afford to sue them
Evil corp wants even more. Ho-hum. Sigh. Anyway…
It’s wild that Steam is getting a class action lawsuit for charging 30% right now, and Apple doing shit like this at the same percentage and legally is getting a free pass.
I’ll throw a hat in the ring here. It’s because Steam has a grip on the gaming market that others want instead of them. That’s it, they want that money instead of Valve. Apple is getting a pass on this because it’s just fucking over the common guy which businesses couldn’t care less about.
But Valve doesn’t have a monopoly on PC games. You can sell your own game, or sell through GOG. On iPhone, Apple has the monopoly and they abuse it.
I was trying to avoid the monopoly complaint because it’s bogus for the reason you said. The truth, Valve has a massive market share and people are very used to Steam, tied to it in many cases. Other publishers tried to set out on their own with their own store fronts and most of those have utterly failed. Even Epic still sells their games on Steam. It’s a powerful market with a lot of brand loyalty that those companies really do want themselves.
Fair.
Other than the “not actually a monopoly” argument, I think it’s important that Steam has that marketshare because they add value. They have a stranglehold on the market similar to the way BarCodes do. You don’t have to register your product with the bar code authority, but it will sure make your product more accessible to more people.
And that’s before cloud saves, achievements, patching infrastructure, community forums, game recording/streaming, and other stuff built into the Steam client/API.
Whether that’s worth a blanket 30% is absolutely a conversation worth having. Maybe it should be a sliding / bracketed scale depending on revenue or units sold or something. But like you said, the big lawsuits are coming from competitors, not smaller developers.
True, but nobody is bound by it. There are other ways to sell on PC, there are no other ways to sell on iPhone. And games bought elsewhere will work just fine on a PC that has Steam installed. Anyone can leave at any time, or buy from anywhere. The only way to do that on iPhone is to switch your entire phone with Android. Apple’s position on the iPhone is far more controlling and monopolistic than Steam’s on PC.
The Steam tax might be too steep as well, but these are not identical situations. It’s far easier to avoid Steam if you don’t want it. I prefer to buy from GOG, and only buy from Steam when it’s cheaper or not available on GOG.
Huh? It’s the businesses that will suffer from that 30% tax. It’s like suddenly seeing your Netflix subscription being more expensive and that triggers this “do I even need it anymore?” evaluation
If it costs 13€ to support a 10€ Patreon pledge, then how do you expect the company to cover for that? Paying the creator less? Still, that will spawn competition, which again hurts the business
Just nitpicking, but if the usual price is 10€ and you want to offload the 30% tax to the consumers, pretty sure the maths should be 10/(0.7) ≈ 14.29€
Parasitic Tech must end. It’s supposed to help us, not spy on us and steal from us.
