Might help also to describe what you think feminism is, since it’s one of those terms that is overloaded.
I once had a physical therapist tell me she wasn’t a feminist because she thought women couldn’t be as physically capable as men when serving as soldiers, and seemed to believe feminism requires treating women exactly like men.
I told her I was a feminist because I believe in equal rights for men and women, an idea she did not seem so opposed to.
There are various schools of feminism, some of which have conflicting opinions. But the common feminist standpoints, like equal rights, seem to be just common sense for me, especially in this day and age. I’m not sure where the requirement for equal physical ability fits into the equation.
At least for me, going out and saying that you are feminist carries a sort of special connotation, and since I haven’t participated in any explicitly activist events related to feminism, I wouldn’t readily emblazon myself with the feminist label even though I stand by those ideas.
the physical therapist had a misconception of what feminism is, probably due to conservative misinformation that presents egalitarian movements like feminism as forcing men and women to be treated the same, and in this case the PT thought this meant soldiers were being forced to have women on their units that would slow them down or make them less effective because they weren’t allowed to vary the tasks based on strength because of “feminism”. I’m not even sure her story was based in reality, tbh - I’m not sure whether the military integrates women soldiers that way, but either way she has internalized some griping from her husband about this.
Either way, it’s interesting to me you wouldn’t identify as a feminist even if you agree with feminism - I wonder what connotations it has, and how those connotations will change if people who are feminists don’t own that … That was part of why I owned being a feminist in my interaction with the PT - she clearly had a misunderstanding of what feminism is, so I clarified why I see myself as a feminist. Otherwise she might not ever be challenged in her views, and “feminism” just becomes the absurd strawman she rejects.
If, say, I hear that “Bob is a feminist”, I reflexively think that Bob is somehow renowned or outspoken in contrast to the general public for supporting feminist causes, perhaps as an educator, figurehead, or activist. I’m not sure what other specific situations I would emphasize myself as feminist, but I’d do the same if put in your situation as a way of standing up.
I think the reflex naturally makes sense, but from the people I personally know to be outspoken and definitionally feminist, it’s more like calling yourself a feminist says you explicitly side with the feminist cause. Sort of like saying you’re anti-racist rather than identifying as someone lacking racism, which is actually a farce when we’re all biased.
oh interesting, the idea is that being a feminist is more than just about beliefs, it implies something more, like being an activist …
I tend to think identifying as a feminist is a lower bar, it just signifies you are in favor of equal rights among genders. I would have no problem identifying as a feminist just broadly - like on a bio, or in conversation.
I have to think about your meaning more, though - I feel like I have some sense of that, it’s maybe a bit like being “vegan” - it implies not just a belief, but maybe also actions you take. Perhaps being a feminist implies something like that in your world, that you are actively engaged in the feminist movement - whether organizing, theorizing, etc.
Either way, thanks for expanding my mind!
it just signifies you are in favor of equal rights among genders
It doesn’t “just signify that” though, as much as feminists act like it does. The term “feminist” does signify a person who, at least ostensibly, is in favor of equal rights among genders, but using that term also, necessarily, implies belief in the harmful dogma that is inseparable from the term itself (patriarchy theory, etc.). This creates a false dichotomy that makes people feel that in order to support equal rights they must also buy into feminist dogma, and that’s not at all the case.
Luckily, though, feminism doesn’t have a monopoly on gender equality, and it’s important to let people know that fact, both because of how incredibly misleading “feminism just means gender equality” is and because there are plenty of other more useful, more egalitarian frameworks through which to view the push for equality.
Yes.
Down with the liars who are talking of freedom and equality for all, while there is an oppressed sex, while there are oppressor classes, while there is private ownership of capital, of shares, while there are the well-fed with their surplus of bread who keep the hungry in bondage. Not freedom for all, not equality for all, but a fight against the oppressors and exploiters!
– Vladimir Lenin, Soviet Power and the Status of Women
Comrades, there is no true social revolution without the liberation of women. May my eyes never see and my feet never take me to a society where half the people are held in silence. I hear the roar of women’s silence. I sense the rumble of their storm and feel the fury of their revolt.
- Thomas Sankara
Thomas Sankara was a true hero that was killed because he dared to threaten the status quo of “haves and have-nots.”
I don’t think so. Haven’t really read feminist theory tho.
best time to plant a tree my friend
As a CIS male I consider myself a feminist because I recognize that women continue to face systemic challenges that demand more than just abstract ideals of equality. To me, feminism goes beyond egalitarianism. It’s not just about treating everyone the same, it’s about recognizing the different challenges people face and working to change the systems that create and sustain those imbalances.
I was raised by my mom and 3 sisters, and that gave me a front-row seat to the everyday injustices women face. Everything from subtle slights to overt discrimination to being victim of abuse. It wasn’t theory for me, it was lived experience, just one degree removed. I’ve seen the strength and resilience of the women in my life, and I’ve also seen what they’ve had to push through simply because of their gender.
Now, as a father with a daughter, I feel an even deeper responsibility to be part of the shift. I don’t just want her to grow up in a world that pays lip service to “equality”. I want her to live in one where she’s safe, respected, and empowered. That means doing more than being “not sexist.” It means actively pushing back against the structures and behaviors (the patriarchy) that holds women back.
I have zero tolerance for toxic masculinity and so-called “alpha male” attitudes that promote dominance, entitlement, and emotional repression. That culture hurts everyone, but it especially harms women by normalizing control and aggression.
I want my daughter and every woman to see examples of men who are allies, not bystanders. Feminism is a promise: to show up, to speak out (or more often shut up), and to help dismantle barriers so that every person, regardless of gender, can thrive without restriction or fear.
Yeah, I’m a feminist. I’m also a masculinist.
Basically, if there’s not a good reason to prevent you from doing something, you shouldn’t be fucking prevented from doing it.
Who or what you were born as, or what you identify as, in and of itself, is not a good fucking reason.
Motherfuckers that try to prevent other people from living their own lives because of their own assumptions need to fucking fuck off.
No harm, no foul.
Somehow ive decided to just live life by this mantra and its going OK so far. I don’t have to understand or like anything that anyone’s doing, but as long as they aren’t hurting anyone its fine.
I’m not, because I do nothing actively in feminist political spaces. I believe opinions count nothing and don’t change the world, so I don’t want to be bundled up with the plenty of people who use it as a label for virtue signaling while not actually putting the effort in.
I think people get too hung up on labels sometimes, but that said… If you’re a feminist, then so am I. I don’t think your PT’s understanding was correct.
For me, feminism is egalitarianism, plain and simple. Yes, I am a feminist, and an egalitarian.
JK Rowling and the other TERFs have kinda ruined that term just like the american right soiled the flag.
I prefer “egalitarian” at this point, less loaded, and gender inclusive. I’m one of those radicals where I want non-traditional families, no gender roles, and all the vanilla straight stuff to all exist side by side in harmony.
Also, women’s clothes needs real pockets. And men need cuter clothes like shortalls. That’s a world I want to be a part of :)
The one thing I’m not egalitarian about- straight men need to be taught to pee sitting down, or at least lift the seat, damn. I know it’s not all of you, but there are a couple of animals out there that need help. :p
What flag?
I think they mean the U.S. flag.
The one thing I’m not egalitarian about- straight men need to be taught to pee sitting down, or at least lift the seat, damn. I know it’s not all of you, but there are a couple of animals out there that need help. :p
This isn’t really a gender issue, either, but I acknowledge men tend to be more of a problem here. But the solution is simple and egalitarian (or feminist, if you prefer): If you make a mess, clean it up. It also works in places besides the bathroom.
I want non-traditional families, no gender roles, and all the vanilla straight stuff to all exist side by side in harmony.
What do you mean by vanilla straight stuff?
The traditional ™️ heterosexual family with two kids and a bio dog. Which is totally fine too, in my book.
I consider myself egalitarian
I feel like the term Feminist gives too much of an impression that I tolerate or encourage misandry, which I certainly do not. That and if you look at feminist groups throughout history TERFs have been the norm, not the exception.
Egalitarian, because sexism cannot be tolerated no matter which direction it’s facing.
I’m a male vegan anarchist and reject every form of mistreatment based on immutable qualities like species, ethnicity, sex etc. At the same time women in my life have consistently broken my trust, which has left me with some generalized cynical views about them. I also believe that the west is at a point where women often receive preferential treatment in sectors like education and hiring, so advocating for them while men are left behind doesn’t make much sense to me. I do not consider myself a feminist.
I wish I could give you like an award for writing the most Lemmy comment of all or something, lol
I’ll write a more thoughtful response later, but in the meantime, thank you for sharing 🧡
EDIT:
more serious response time:
I was wondering why you believe women receive preferential treatment in hiring and education, what I have read is that empirically women are more likely to be turned down for jobs and they experience greater rates of unemployment and longer employment gaps than men (in the U.S.).
Do you mean you wouldn’t advocate for women in employment and hiring based on your views, or just generally? Because there are still many stark disparities between men and women in the West (including pay, cost of healthcare, sexual violence rates, and so on).
It’s surprising to me that you identify as an egalitarian and anarchist, but don’t consider yourself a feminist - what do you think feminism is, if not a movement for gender equality?
I am a feminist because I believe men and women should have equal rights. I think a lot of people fell for the propaganda that feminism is about women over men or something. The thing a lot of men fail to realize is that “the patriarchy” hurts them too. A lot of the things you see men complain about like being told to “man up” or not being able to express their feelings without being mocked are 100% a side effect of patriarchy.
I would love to rephrase the word to “Equalist”.
Equal rights for all!Equal rights for all!
That’s what feminism is. That’s my whole point about people falling for the propaganda that it means something else.
The word you’re looking for already exists, it’s egalitarianism lol.
Well.The word problem is solved. Hooray.
Can the world now calm the hell down and just be peaceful with everyone playing nice? :(
“Man up” isn’t always about bottling your feeling like the US internet says. More often it’s “stop complaining and just do it”. And someone has to do “it”. And it often leads to growth.
The internet often distorts things.
As for the topic, I am a feminist. The first and second wave feminism, that is. The equality ones. Not the pink haired screaming “all men are evil and should pay” third wave. Everybody screaming “patriarchy” while sitting on their bed, not even looking further then that. Looking at everything black and white.
Actually, I’m kinder to women then men…
“Man up” isn’t always about bottling your feeling like the US internet says. More often it’s “stop complaining and just do it”. And someone has to do “it”. And it often leads to growth.
I’m sure telling people who are hesitant to open up about their feelings and want to express them more to “stop complaining and just do it” will definitely make them open up about their feelings. 🙄 Way to miss the point entirely.
Not the pink haired screaming “all men are evil and should pay”
I don’t think that caricature helps promote gender equality.
As for the topic, I am a feminist. The first and second wave feminism, that is. The equality ones. Not the pink haired screaming “all men are evil and should pay” third wave.
Actually, I’m kinder to women then men…
If a feminist is just anyone who supports woman’s rights then yes I am a feminist. I’m not an activist though I don’t go out of my way to help.
It means if you think women should have the same rights as men. I am a feminist.
I think I’m more egalitarian. But this is largely dependent on what you mean by feminism.
I believe all women should have total agency over themselves. I believe they deserve equal pay, treatment, and rights. I believe them when they discuss their issues and the prevalence of sexual assault and abuse.
I also believe that there are structures in our society that unfairly put them above men. For instance, in child care and criminal sentencing. Women tend to get the benefit of doubt that they are the better parent and that the relationship between a child and a mother is generally more important than that of a child and father. Women also, in general, get lighter sentences for the same crime.
I believe that we should be more equal in the value we place on the relationship between a child and it’s father. Raising the importance of how we as a society view that relationship rather than bringing down the importance of the mothers relationship.
I also believe we should lighten the sentences of men to be more in line with women’s sentencing. Although that largely falls in line with my personal opinion that criminal sentencing in this country is far, far too harsh.
Women tend to get the benefit of doubt that they are the better parent and that the relationship between a child and a mother is generally more important than that of a child and father.
ironically I would give this as an example of patriarchy, as precisely the kind of thing feminism aims to eliminate …
Raising the importance of how we as a society view that relationship rather than bringing down the importance of the mothers relationship.
I think the feminist approach might be to stop thinking of children as primarily the responsibility of mothers, that both parents should be responsible and engaged, such that the courts wouldn’t assume the mother is “the parent”, while the father is more like a “provider” (that’s the patriarchal setup - women don’t earn, they stay home and serve as housekeepers and caretakers without pay or economic autonomy, under the control of the patriarch of the family who earns & controls the money).
Although that largely falls in line with my personal opinion that criminal sentencing in this country is far, far too harsh.
if you are talking about the U.S., there is a huge discussion about prison abolitionism, but I think there is significant overlap between various social justice movements, and contemporary feminism has been focused on recognizing how interconnected these struggles are (we can’t just narrowly consider “women”, as that often leads to only considering the experiences and rights of cis, middle and upper class, white, and able-bodied women).
This directly brings up the question of what is feminism and the various waves it’s gone through.
I would consider the abolition of a “patriarchy” separate from feminism. I think there are various criticisms of that notion and it’s rather cultural centric viewpoint. Raising women doesn’t have to come at the notion that men must be brought down. I don’t consider egalitarianism to be a zero sum game.
If your definition of feminism includes the dismantling of patriarchy, I don’t think I’m entirely convinced patriarchy isn’t a mislabeling of the underlying systemic issues in our society. And I don’t particularly like the implied core issue being men are holding women back.
Society as a whole has radically changed with regards to how women are viewed and their role in this social construct, even with the current political climate and the unfortunate direction it’s turned. The feminist movement has found incredible ground and made significant headway, and I’m incredibly impressed and overjoyed to see it.
I still see a lot of change that needs to happen for us to really reach equal footing. But I may not share the same idea of what the root cause of that inequality is.
As for the discussion of other social justice movements, my underlying beliefs remain the same. Raise the lowest among us, provide the same opportunities and social support, and treat everyone with respect.
