I respect people’s right to use apple products, but please stop asserting “privacy”, big corps doesn’t give a shit.
After using GrapheneOS on a gigantic fucking Android pixel model, I think I’m gravitating back towards the third option and the iphone mini I haven’t dared to sell yet. I think I’ll just do the things that needs privacy on my computer in the future.
ITT
“I give up”
What a weird strawman
Google literally copied this from Apple.
Lol what?
Comparatively they are better. Its a duopoly in terms of mobile OSs and one is made by a company who mines data and sells ads as its core. The other sells hardware and subscriptions.
I use linux and I wish for a full featured marketable linux phone someday that can compete but with privacy they absolutely beat google.
I have never owned an iphone amd I am currently debating on getting a pixel to move to gOS.
I’m all for linux, I miss the market before iPhone domination. Weird ass symbian phones, windows phones, nokia taco phones, there was all sorts of stuff. I wish we could have a market like that with lots of diverse phones that all run different operating systems. I also wish we could step away from app stores and we could just start building websites again, phones are fast enough now
The problem is not with Android its with Google But apparently android is from Google even though its open source. Sure, linux phones are nice but they are nowhere near stable.
The problem is we do everything with mobile phones now even banking and security is a big lead here The Banking apps may need to make sure each and every linux phones are secure and may not have any loopholes Which is tedious Even installing a custom rom can hinder the default security sometimes. If any problems arise neither linux phones nor banks can give any warranty As of now android is more secure and stable and theres a lot of time ahead of linux phones to succeed
How are devs supposed to test their apps on devices before they publish?
They can upload their ID to google, pay $25 USD, and then sign their apps using their own signing key which was pre-approved by Google.
Its the same for apple, but I think their fees are like $99 per year.
There are also reports of Google potentially leaving in a ADB bypass for it.
Um…who actually thinks #3? Apple tells you they sell your stuff and makes app devs tell you. They still sell it, mine it, tailor it for ads, all the same stuff as Google…but just not as pervasive.
The GrapheneOS people. Everyone in their IRC unironically thinks Iphones are highly secure, in part BECAUSE they are proprietary. But they also don’t tolerate any criticism of Google, especially if you criticize Google for being proprietary.
I saw one person saying basically that yesterday, but it was heavily downvoted.
Once my GrapheneOS phone goes out of service, I may just go back to flip phones. I actually kind of hate smartphones and their corrosive effect on the world. The convenience isn’t worth the loss of privacy, empowerment of bad actors, and psychological/societal damage. I can live without it. I’ll just do computery stuff on real computers on my own schedule.
I’m just saying that you can uninstall stuff from your smart phone.
Use it for phone stuff, not computer stuff.
But hey, don’t let me tell you what to do. Have fun.
Removed by mod
Does anyone remember r/hailcorporate and its brief moment of fame before the popular subs banned mention of it and its own mods started running a crypto scam?
It was annoying. Couldn’t mention any brand name in any context without getting an “/r/hailcorporate” comment.
I liked that part of it anyway
Perhaps there’s scope to have a phone be just a dumb ‘viewer’ and all the processing and apps run on a suitably configured Linux pc or virtual environment at home. The internet in general is getting fast enough that the latency might not be an issue, and it would not need a powerful phone.
Poor example below, controlling an old phone using Rustdesk.
It’s really funny seeing people who defend capitalism trying to avoid capitalism problems with individual actions instead of organizing themselves and fighting for the interest of their own class
Thia guy i know to a tee. He’ll defend capitalism to the death and say how the left is evil and anarchy capitalism is the only way.
Idiot. And he pitches about everything in life capitalism causes. I point this out and he says well yeah but thats just bad capitalism not good capitalism. Also he loves fElon, so there’s that.
Dumb phones, has anyone tried: https://sunbeamwireless.com/ ?
Interesting. Looks to be based on Android AOSP which kind of puts you in the same boat. Th price tag kind of hurts as well at $250 give or take depending on features.
Idk what I’m gonna do if the F-Store stops working.
Yoink from github via Obtainium.
Also, obtainium can also yoink from gitlab, selfhisted forgejo, codeberg and also fdroid.
it doesn’t matter if apple cares about privacy. corpos shouldn’t have this data in the first place.
Who should?
Assuming there will still be a way for devs to run apps without store BS. Won’t this just push users to run the apps the same way? All they’re threatening with is that they will no longer provide updates or security screening or something, which will be even better for backward compatibility. If this forces enough users to learn enough devops just this once to enter the paradise that is free from corporate security theatre you bet your ass they’re not going back
Apple does give a shit about privacy… in the same way that companies care about gay pride. Right now privacy is still a selling point for Apple compared to other companies. This is why they are still so loud about on device AI and pretty much silent when any of their features require cloud processing. But am under no illusions that will remain the case forever.
As far as “dumb phones” are concerned; they don’t exist anymore. It’s still a device with an OS, GPS (as required by the law that created the Amber Alert here in the US), and an Internet connection, that makes calls using VoLTE or similar. Most of the ones you can buy today run things like KaiOS which has an App Store and comes with Google Maps preinstalled.
If you want real privacy you need to disconnect from the Internet which pretty much means no phones at all now that everything is VoIP.
Apple has 2x very publicly resisted government demands for user data and campaigned against laws to institute backdoors into their software and services. They’re not perfect by any means but they are by far a lesser evil.
A fully capable Linux phone is the dream, but most people aren’t going to use one. For the majority of people, I would recommend the company that refused to listen to the US and EU about weakening the security of their products over the one with the business model of relying on advertising to you and selling your data.
Apple has 2x very publicly resisted government demands for user data and campaigned against laws to institute backdoors into their software and services.
Indeed.
They also immediately folded in China after being given the ultimatum of comply or die.
All it would take is Trump to give the same ultimatum…
Yeah I would expect the same of any company. They have to comply with the laws of the country they do business in. This same requirement compelled them to finally add USB-C to iPhones and allow alternate app stores.
I wouldn’t blame Google for doing the same, so I’m not going to blame Apple for it either. Do you actually expect any company their size to do any different?
To the extent they’re legally able to, Apple has absolutely resisted compromising their device security features to aid law enforcement.
Good thing Trump’s distracted by gold baubles.
Was giving literal gold to Donald Trump part of that campaign to save the users?
No that was Tim Apple kissing the ring to minimize tariffs. And it worked.
They just do that for brand optics. Because researchers found the apple privacy settings off/on made no difference to the packet of info sent to apple. Their privacy is a facade.
I can believe this. Apple loves to talk big about privacy but their source for it is “trust me bro.”
The issue in one of the cases (San Bernardino) had nothing to do with iCloud data, and everything to do with the data on the device itself. The FBI request was a backdoor into the device. Apple (rightly) refused to add a backdoor to access the phone.
You are referencing data that goes to Apple’s iCloud servers, which Apple was happy to provide because they held the encryption keys. Since then, they have enabled an E2E encryption feature for iCloud data.
I am happy to discuss Apple’s shortcomings, but let’s be clear on which ones we’re discussing
Its the don’t track privacy type settings where you opt out, research found it was a toggle button that did nothing.
They only tout privacy to gain market, they would sell us out for a dollar
Is this separate from Advanced Data Protection, which is E2E encrypted data on iCloud?
“Don’t track privacy type settings” isn’t very descriptive, so apologies if I’m sounding any way I’m just trying to be clear about what the complaint here is.
And to be clear, is this a privacy concern exclusive to Apple?
Totally unrelated to the E2E, I will have to search for it. It was a year or two ago. Apple claimed turning off the data collection kept your use private to you, but was just a lie, they collected all your data anyway.
And yes, its an IPhone setting not an android setting. Google is another issue.
Ok please let me know when you have more information I am very interested to know.
And they have proven if the government makes a law requiring access they’ll do it. They have done it for China and Russia.
Well yeah they kinda have to at that point in order to continue conducting business in that country. What about this is specific to Apple?
That’s literally any company though. If you want to legally operate in a certain country, you need to abide by the country’s laws. Sure, pirate FOSS projects could exist. But that’s not the kind of shit that will be sold in retail, because it would literally be illegal to sell.
This is like complaining that Japanese phones can’t disable the camera shutter sound. It’s because Japan regulated the shutter sound, because upskirting was a major issue. So phones legally sold in Japan are required to have the shutter sound permanently set at a high volume, even when the ringer is silenced. That isn’t the phone maker’s fault.
Apple campaigned against regulation like what you’re complaining about. It isn’t Apple’s fault that the regulation was passed anyways.
You’re saying the same thing as the top of the thread. All of this is for now. At some point it could be advantageous for Apple to stop resisting US demands. It is important to understand and prepare for that while also accepting, for now, Apple provides the most corporate privacy of the corporate privacy options in the US.
The three of us are in agreement.
Mostly agree except about disconnecting from the internet, classic SMS/voice calls aren’t any more private than VoIP.
Your best bet for location privacy is E2E encrypted services like Signal over wifi, plus MAC randomization and a VPN on untrusted networks. I’d say GrapheneOS is good enough for most people, but mobile Linux has also come a long way.
Encryption doesn’t stop them from knowing what tower you are attached to. Simply having a phone on you even with the GPS and WiFi off (or with the newer phones even the whole phone off) would still be enough to get your location to within a few hundred feet. The original iPhone used triangulation exclusively for location.
