In truth it’s probably a bit of both, there likely aren’t enough buses/routes and there are not enough buses on each route. Typically in most US cities, even State capitals, buses just don’t have enough usage to justify doubling or tripling them to either create more routes or reduce frequency. In some cities they do have super limited routes that may be meandering, but have less stops, or are short in length to maximize frequency, but generally this is for a very specific route.
I used to live in a large US city in the south east that had a bus route that ran from a designated parking lot to a major industrial area. A one way trip for the bus was around 40 minutes (they had isolated bus only lanes with enforcement) and if you were to drive in traffic it would take 35 min to an hour. On the other hand my bus commute in that city would have been at least 2 hours to and from my workplace because it wasn’t that specific route.
Similar situation when I was in college, the main campus was only like 2 miles long. My furthest class was about a mile away, but between waiting for the bus to arrive and then also waiting for it to drive across campus it was generally faster to just walk. After maybe the first week I never rode the bus again.
Sure, I’ve seen that, so you got me thinking on it. The largest city near me has 1 way adult bus fare at $2.20 one way and express bus fare at $3.00. The city’s internal minimum wage is $25/hour. To add an extra vehicle you would need a minimum of 8.3 passengers per hour of service to recoup costs of just the driver’s wages. This doesn’t include vehicle maintenance or all the other costs of employment (contributions to his 401k, contributions to the pension fund, the employer match for personal insurance, workplace insurance, etc).
Realistically you probably need greater than 12 passengers per hour per extra vehicle you add and that’s on speculative hope that if you reach a certain coverage threshold people will use it rather than drive their own car. It explains itself why it’s a hard sell to politicians.
I think that generally depends on the city, but most cities will have what are known as Enterprise funds. This generally applies to things like the Utility Departments (water, power, and some cities even run an internet service provider) where rather than running on taxes these programs need to function almost entirely from funds they bring in for charging for their services. Things like road and sidewalk maintenance wouldn’t fall into Enterprise fund operation since there is no active service being rendered that can be charged for, though you could have toll roads but they are exceptionally unpopular in the US.
A bus or rail system could be an Enterprise fund, but it probably depends on where you’re at. The public transit system in NYC is an enterprise fund because they have enough usage that they can raise funds from services to cover their costs, but a bus system in a rural city might not be an enterprise fund if it’s being used almost solely to provide the elderly or poor with transportation.
In addition to Enterprise funds, US cities operate as businesses (ie they must have balanced budgets and operate within their means, they don’t get to act like the federal government and just close down). In most cases if you said we’re going to triple the buses/vans but now instead of being revenue neutral it’s going to lose money it won’t get approved.
There’s a bus stop just a few blocks from my house, but the bus only comes by once every two hours between 9am-5pm. There’s also a very stupid hub design to the routes, so if you live in City B, you need to take a bus 15 miles to the hub in City A, so you can transfer to the bus for City C, even though B and C are less than 5 miles apart.
That sounds like bus routes are either very meandery or they aren’t frequent.
In truth it’s probably a bit of both, there likely aren’t enough buses/routes and there are not enough buses on each route. Typically in most US cities, even State capitals, buses just don’t have enough usage to justify doubling or tripling them to either create more routes or reduce frequency. In some cities they do have super limited routes that may be meandering, but have less stops, or are short in length to maximize frequency, but generally this is for a very specific route.
I used to live in a large US city in the south east that had a bus route that ran from a designated parking lot to a major industrial area. A one way trip for the bus was around 40 minutes (they had isolated bus only lanes with enforcement) and if you were to drive in traffic it would take 35 min to an hour. On the other hand my bus commute in that city would have been at least 2 hours to and from my workplace because it wasn’t that specific route.
Similar situation when I was in college, the main campus was only like 2 miles long. My furthest class was about a mile away, but between waiting for the bus to arrive and then also waiting for it to drive across campus it was generally faster to just walk. After maybe the first week I never rode the bus again.
Smaller buses. Some cities just use vans for smaller routes.
Sure, I’ve seen that, so you got me thinking on it. The largest city near me has 1 way adult bus fare at $2.20 one way and express bus fare at $3.00. The city’s internal minimum wage is $25/hour. To add an extra vehicle you would need a minimum of 8.3 passengers per hour of service to recoup costs of just the driver’s wages. This doesn’t include vehicle maintenance or all the other costs of employment (contributions to his 401k, contributions to the pension fund, the employer match for personal insurance, workplace insurance, etc).
Realistically you probably need greater than 12 passengers per hour per extra vehicle you add and that’s on speculative hope that if you reach a certain coverage threshold people will use it rather than drive their own car. It explains itself why it’s a hard sell to politicians.
Your public transit has to pay for itself? Are your roads and sidewalks self-funding too?
I think that generally depends on the city, but most cities will have what are known as Enterprise funds. This generally applies to things like the Utility Departments (water, power, and some cities even run an internet service provider) where rather than running on taxes these programs need to function almost entirely from funds they bring in for charging for their services. Things like road and sidewalk maintenance wouldn’t fall into Enterprise fund operation since there is no active service being rendered that can be charged for, though you could have toll roads but they are exceptionally unpopular in the US.
A bus or rail system could be an Enterprise fund, but it probably depends on where you’re at. The public transit system in NYC is an enterprise fund because they have enough usage that they can raise funds from services to cover their costs, but a bus system in a rural city might not be an enterprise fund if it’s being used almost solely to provide the elderly or poor with transportation.
In addition to Enterprise funds, US cities operate as businesses (ie they must have balanced budgets and operate within their means, they don’t get to act like the federal government and just close down). In most cases if you said we’re going to triple the buses/vans but now instead of being revenue neutral it’s going to lose money it won’t get approved.
Yeah I think it’s politics… “look we have busses and no one uses them we are just wasting money on them”.
He probably misread the schedules because I refuse to believe 2.8 miles takes 9 hours. That is some serious “meandering”.
9 hours!
Frequency doesn’t matter if the route is somewhat direct, unless you say a 9 hour trip includes 8.5 hours of waiting on the bus?
I suspect its, A->B 10 mins, wait at B for 9 hours, B->C 10 mins.
You could walk 2.8 miles in about an hour.
Where ? On the busy road ?
Forgive them, they’re probably not American and don’t realise how shockingly dangerous by design it is to walk anywhere in America.
Over in Europe, a distance of less than 3 miles will often be best ridden, and if not you’d walk it.
There’s a bus stop just a few blocks from my house, but the bus only comes by once every two hours between 9am-5pm. There’s also a very stupid hub design to the routes, so if you live in City B, you need to take a bus 15 miles to the hub in City A, so you can transfer to the bus for City C, even though B and C are less than 5 miles apart.