• Marquesas@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    Sort of. Miller has been involved in developing and test running the concept on years, see Hungary (field test of the fearmongering populism + the “Mike Johnson” special - we had “don’t know, wasn’t there, didn’t hear about it, ask someone else” press conference memes like 12 years ago) and other examples. Definitely involved to some degree with Fico and Putin, and to a lesser extent, Babis, Meloni and Simion. They weren’t sure they could get away with it last time Trump was up there, although if my memory serves, national guard was deployed due to maybe BLM?

    I mean really, it’s shocking how fast it ramped up but I cannot say that I’m truly surprised it did happen, and if I look back at the people involved in it, it seems more like a gentle increase of the knob than a sudden twist. It’s also just that the higher you are on the dial, the closer together are the red lines.

    • jj4211@lemmy.world
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      16 hours ago

      They basically spent the last 4 years planning how to make it happen as quickly as possible.

      If they haven’t finished within a year, the job risks getting much harder with an uncooperative Congress. So they have to speedrun it, no chance to do it by slow measures.

      However even if 2027 swears in the results of free and fair elections, their goals are still doable, since the government said point blank the only group that can possible hold Trump accountable is 2/3rds of the senate, and that’s not happening, and everyone else that might otherwise be more reachable can be pardoned by Trump at will.

      So they can get in the way of new legislation, but not pass anything (veto also needs 2/3rds, which they are not getting). The administration has already proven that they don’t wait for a law when they really want to do something.

      So unless democrats somehow win every single senate race that’s up for grabs in 2026, they still aren’t going to be able to do anything by the book to actually walk things back.

      • Marquesas@lemmy.world
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        16 hours ago

        The midterms fixing anything is basically a dream, nothing else. Presidential elections might… but the democracy is unlikely to survive until then.

    • aesthelete@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      I mean really, it’s shocking how fast it ramped up but I cannot say that I’m truly surprised it did happen, and if I look back at the people involved in it, it seems more like a gentle increase of the knob than a sudden twist. It’s also just that the higher you are on the dial, the closer together are the red lines.

      Yeah I wouldn’t say I’m surprised, and I wouldn’t say it’s entirely “UnPReCEDenTeD” or anything, but it is new and different in terms of scope, brazenness, and certainly technology. We’ve struggled with periods of waxing and waning fascism and fascist-like governance for practically the entire history of the country. The Alien and Sedition Acts were passed into law when the country was less than two decades old. But this is still shocking, smothering, abhorrent and a departure from even ten years ago.

      The argument that the US is or was always like this and could only be like this is, in my view, made intentionally to paralyze and further demoralize those of us in the US who wake to a fresh, new hell on a daily basis.

      • Marquesas@lemmy.world
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        2 days ago

        There’s a world of difference between “was always like this” and “could only be like this”.

        This is precisely what the fall of Nixon has been building up to, brick by brick. But the fact is that sitting presidents could do literally whatever they wanted since at least the Bush era. It’s almost a wonder it took this long for someone to take advantage of that possibility. In that regard, it has been like this for a long time, they’ve just been very careful about what they do. And the funniest thing is that they still are. I find the claims for example that Trump is doing this to provoke a violent reaction so that the army can be deployed almost comical. Why? If you need to provoke a reaction, provoke harder. If you don’t, well, why don’t you just deploy the army for no good reason. He can, after all. He could literally attempt to murder his political opponent by coughing at him knowingly while having COVID. Bush could gaslight the entire NATO into furthering US imperial goals in the Middle East. Bush was allowed to walk away with what was essentially a stolen election. For all we know, Clinton could’ve been raping children on Epstein Island while he was sitting president. It’s been like this for god knows how long, this is the first guy with the sheer audacity to do it out in the open.

        The could be different is then another question, right? I think you see the problem about how far this reaches. Almost everyone with a significant amount of capital in the US is all in on this. Media is playing along the party status quo, the faces of tech can finally come out of the closet and fall in line as nazis, insurance companies have been death dealers for the longest time, and now, a slimy greasy businessman and not politician is in charge of the country. Could it be different - sure. But the house cleaning is effectively insurmountable. Every career politician on corporate bankroll, wall street, CEOs, boardrooms, corporate private militaries, and of course, the human waste who proudly exercise their 2nd amendment rights to serve their oligarch overlords. So yeah, it could be different, but it won’t be, not like this. The system is not set up in a way that you can democratically elect someone that isn’t beholden to the interests of the same people, and is willing to do anything about it. And even those who would be willing to do anything about it will find that all the other branches are long time gone. The same supreme court that gives Trump a complete blank check to bypass the legislative branch can take the same blank check away from any progressive president for reason. You can’t rely on party lines in the legislative to help you out either, if you’re a progressive president you were miraculously elected as an independent - dems are in just as deep as GOP.

        So yeah. It’s paralyzing, it’s demoralizing, but it’s also just the reality. The knob only goes way up or slightly down. Up to you how to react to that. In the same situation, I decided to up and leave my home country. It was the best decision ever.

        • aesthelete@lemmy.world
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          1 day ago

          So yeah. It’s paralyzing, it’s demoralizing, but it’s also just the reality. The knob only goes way up or slightly down.

          See, this is the problem with pretending that things were always like this, it makes it so that you think it’s impossible to ever fix anything.

          • Marquesas@lemmy.world
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            17 hours ago

            Again, the question is what is the anything you want to fix. Where is your milestone? You want the morons with guns off the street, sure, assuming the Thiel machine catches some rocks in its cogs and there’s going to be elections, you ride it out for three more years, by some miracle Musk doesn’t steal the election again and bing bang boom, you have it fixed. And by fixed, we mean you gently escorted the problem back into the bottle and loosely popped in the cork. The root causes - oligarchic big tech, hostile SCOTUS, far-right thinktank, misinformation centrals - are still there. For all intents and purposes, it’s not like this anymore, but it’s actually still like this, it’s just quieter for a couple of years.

            • aesthelete@lemmy.world
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              6 hours ago

              There have been many different eras in America, and although the current one is terrible, there will be another, one way or another.

              When you see America as being a single static thing, you view it as an unchanging monolith that has never had periods of time where elements of it were better – making it so that the only choice you have is to “love it, or leave it”.

              But these are faulty views, and that is a false dichotomy. We are participants in the history of the country, not merely spectators. Through collective action we can change its direction. We did this before via blood, sweat, and tears in the first gilded age, and we will have to do it again here in the second.