As it turns out it doesn’t actually cost that much on regular transit, there’s an AIRPORT SURCHARGE because it’s an “airport train”.
No wonder Americans don’t use public transit, even when the system exists it’s ridiculously difficult and expensive to use.
Here in Kansas City our transit was free for the past four years.
The downer is that, since we subsidized the public transit here in the city, the various suburbs opted to stop funding the routes that went into their various towns and cities, so now fares are going to be re-introduced.
At least the streetcar is going to remain free here, for now, and likely through 2026 due to the World Cup.
Olathe and OP are two big reasons we can’t have anything nice here. The streetcar is staying on the Missouri side only (at least for now) so I’m hopeful it’ll stay free.
You’re not wrong. Those two cities love their cars and their shitty chain stores.
goddamn you know you live in a fucked up society when the missouri side of your city is the more progressive.
Yeah. To be fair, those 2 cities represent the worst in yuppie suburbanism and “i got mine” mentality, so the bar for comparison is really low
This is more of a “city vs suburb” issue than the difference between 2 adjacent states.
eh, I just despise missouri more for having to live there repeatedly. not that kansas is utopia, but living in missouri was uniquely depressing.
missouri was uniquely depressing
It’s why some people pronounce it as “misery”
When you have free public transport it ceases to be strictly public transport, and becomes half homeless shelter. No one wants to ride around with people who are all too often drug riddled, mentally ill, and just all around awful to be in an enclosed space with. I have sympathy for and want to help that demographic, but turning public transport into extremely expensive homeless day rooms ain’t it.
Edit: down vote me all you like, free fares is an awful idea. If we want functional and useful public transport in this country we have to have it be safe and clean. I say this as someone who hasn’t owned a personal auto in 12 plus years. I love and use public transport every day. Drug addled assholes are a problem.
Oh, I know.
That’s partly why I carry a stun-gun everywhere now.
This conversation was just had in another thread but you’re far better off with pepper spray. Get a friend to zap you with the stun gun, then ask yourself a question. If I was intent on being violent, would this stop me or just piss me off? For me the answer is the latter, and I’ve been stun gunned, even cattle prodded, messing around being stupid when I was younger.
Any critique of homeless people gets insta-downvoted unfortunately. The KC transit system, which I like, is rife with homeless people and many of them are visibly maladjusted and the people downvoting you would be instantly afraid of them. I’ve had one try to physically intimidate me, so now I carry a pocket stun-gun everywhere.
In fact, our streetcar is getting armed security guards because of said maladjusted homeless people.
I once went through a BART gate line by mistake, I was trying to get to the trolley service and misread the signage. I immediately exited. The charge: $6.20. Still can’t believe it.
I walked off the train into a depowered station at night and couldnt scan off at the station, so I got on a bus and it depleted my card, then the next day I got a ticket for riding the bus without paying because the computer stole all my money and the guy giving me a ticket couldnt care less that I actually payed more than I should have but just kept repeating that I “should have had more money on the card”
Use cash.
I did this once in Tokyo, besides a stern looking at I didn’t have to pay anything.
FYI, airport surcharges are very common. Across the bay at Oakland has an airport surcharge. Sydney has them too, which I was happy about because Melbourne doesn’t have a train (AU $25 for a bus ticket, which was sold out) nor did Hobart. I recall AREX in Incheon also having a significant fare jump for the airport stops.
For argument purposes, BART is $0.18/mile (19th Oakland <> Berryessa). That’s still pretty high for regional public transit, which is mostly due to BART’s high farebox recovery. That high recovery is now a problem with the whole pandemic and subsequent slow return of ridership.
But in Sydney you will pay the surcharge only when you get off or on at the actual airport station. Just using that line and passing the airport will cost you nothing extra. Usually less than 4 AUD for the whole trip.
It’s the same situation with BART. The surcharge only applies when using the airport stations. No extra charge if you’re passing by.
London has a expensive express line from Heathrow to the city and a regular underground line that costs a fraction.
Cool. I’ll be in London in a few months. Are the express trains nicer or are they the same sets as the local, but faster?
You worried about nice train seats instead of just getting to where you’re going lmao
I didn’t use them, so no idea if they are nicer - but they were quite a bit faster, yes.
Pro tip for London: You can swipe your credit card at the entry and exit points of your underground travels and it will cost you much less then any tourist tickets they sell.
The Narita Express also costs significantly more than the regular train into Tokyo. Airport trains have to account for travelers with a lot of luggage and thus can carry fewer people than regular trains.
BART trainsets are uniform. No special airport trains.
It has been a long time since I’ve been to Tokyo. Narita trains are nice but I never managed to catch the express. Even so, the local is still really nice. :)
The Sydney airport line uses the exact same rolling stock as the rest of the suburban network (and the airport stations are just stops along the line, not their own dedicated line). The surcharge is just revenue raising because the train is the easiest way to get to the airport, so fuck you, pay up.
I had to go through SF a few times this year. I have no idea how much the transit cost, but it was fucking expensive and I just rode a few times per day across town or to the airport.
I love public transit systems and being free to move around a city using them. It’s a truly liberating experience to have real freedom, but damn SF was tough to understand and weird in places. They’ve got to unify the system and start paying for it or it’s going to just keep crushing their downtown areas when no one uses the transit to visit.
Unifying the system might actually hurt it more then help. MUNI the bus and light rail system within the city is relatively cheap, $2.75 fare to ride any where. That’s because it’s funded mostly by the city because people in the city use and value it more. BART, the metro that’s posted in the picture is funded by all the suburban and urban municipalities that it serves in the metro area, and since the suburban cities don’t use/ value it as much it’s hard to get funding for it passed through taxes so they rely more on fares.
If they unified it then the minority of people in the city wouldn’t be able to pass taxes to improve, or at this point maintain, service and we’d get stuck with high fares and low service.
For example in the last election a majority of people voted to tax rideshares to pay for the bus in the city, it didn’t pass because another ballot measure that passed had some fine print nullified it, but that kind of measure would never have passed throughout the whole bay area.
That’s an expensive fare
People pay to ride the train?
Some good-two shoes do, most do, but alot of people dont. hence reddit had whole host of people being, caught,evading fares, you got people on there being a know it all, and you should be paying your fare share.
Oh for bay area, there are specific times of the year, that inspectors come out in droves to “ticket” as much people as possible, usually its around summer-to fall, and then maybe winter. there has been discussion how the evasion tickets are much more than TRAFFIC tickets/parking tickets. right now is about 135$ for each violation, and there are all sorts of tricks to avoid that even if yuo get ticketed. there is alot of justification for evading fares.
I pay my taxes, which I’m told goes to public transit, and there was a huge scandal with the transit department in my state a while back where we found out they were fucking everyone over and skimming a fucked up amount of money and the state did pretty much nothing about it, so when the transit department is stealing less from public transit than I am I’ll consider it, but I also feel that public transit should be free, especially if I’m already paying for it.
our taxes pay for it already, only amount to under 20% in fares of the budget. but federal govt decided it wasnt enough to give them money for the budget, so all these underhanded inspections have occured over the years. now with trump in power, the money coming from federal is even less certain.
As I said, if they decide to stop fucking us over I’ll decide to stop fucking them over. Also, my state was taxing enough to line the pockets of the conservative representatives that are bleeding the state dry on every other front of politics and social structure and ecology on top of this, which is why nobody had to face any music over the bullshit they’re continuing to pull, if they have problems with people not paying five bucks to go ten blocks then that is a problem they created and a problem for them to solve. And with the price gouging they are doing with the sea of university students having to bus or train from three districts away because they can’t afford dorms or housing in the city, my 8 block jump to work isn’t taking the food off of anyone’s table.
people pay for public transport?
Of course! If not at the time of use, then via taxes coming out of their paycheck… but usually both.
dw it was a silly joke
Way less in taxes than road construction and maintenance.
Do you live in Luxembourg? Most places have fares for public transport
they probably jump the fare gates
tallinn
Unfortunately. At least ours is cheap
In Toronto, you get free transfers for 2 hours for $3. I can run an errand across the city and come back for a single fixed price.
I’ve never been to Toronto but I’ll be there next week. Parking is a mess where I’m staying near downtown, I may use this!
Parking honestly isn’t terrible but a lot of it is residency based, so yeah it’s harder as a visitor. I think you can get a temporary visitor parking pass at City Hall depending on how long you’re staying for.
For the TTC (titty sea!), download the Presto app ahead of time or buy a Presto card when you get here. Also be sure to check out the PATH!
You picked a lovely time to visit, the weather is wonderful right now! (Aside from the week of rain we just had)
Same in nyc. For $2.9.
You only get unlimited transfers in NYC until you leave a station. You get 1 reentrance or switch to / from a bus per 2 hours.
I actually lived there for most of my life, NY’s metro does not compare. Only in-station transfers are free, one every 2hr. If you need to transfer from the 2 to the C in Brownsville, godspeed. Half the time it charges you anyways when it’s not supposed to. Don’t get me started on the lack of connection between the G and Atlantic, and the non-existent M loop.
Toronto is still about 50 cents cheaper via the exchange rate. Transit is far more reliable, and the average subway station is waaaaay nicer.
Fuck the MTA
it used to 90min for the longest time in sf, like decades. until recently.
Pauli’s transport should have been free
JFK rail transfer to Jamaica Queens is like… Shit like 8.50? Then you can get on the ‘regular’ subway. It’s way cheaper (and can take about the same time from Manhattan) than using a taxi or an Uber.
So your airport transportation is 8.50 on top of your metro card (34 a week which easily is covered if you are about the city at all).
WAY cheaper using the subway in NYC than owning a vehicle. A month for the metro is 132 for comparison.
Bart is expensive, but some of the best transit in America unfortunately. Why I generally just hop the gate by pushing through before the things close
A bus ticket for me to get to work is $3.50 and it’s about 1h40m. It takes roughly 35-45 minutes to drive. Idk if that’s good or not but I consider myself lucky that I don’t need to transfer buses
This is the norm where I live too, AND my city has a relatively good public transportation system.
Meanwhile here in Germany I can use any bus, tram, U-Bahn, or train (excluding high speed) anywhere in the country for 58€/month
Yeah with the 10 euro ticket.
But if you don’t have the D-ticket, good luck figuring out how the local ticketing machine works haha
The DeutschlandTicket is the best thing! I love it. I want that with their Steuernummer, baby’s get a DeutschlandTicket. Everybody needs a DeutschlandTicket.
I’ve been wondering why this hasn’t become a thing yet. Probably lobbying from all the Verkehrsverbünde.
No, they really want to keep it as cheap as possible. It’s the Bundesregierung that rather subsidises Diesel privileges and Pendlerpauschalen.
I want that in the Netherlands as well. Much smaller country, so less value for your money. But now you pay even more (€66) for a return ticket from the east border to the west border (Winterswijk - Scheveningen).
It cost me about £60 for one return rail ticket last week 😭 that’s not including the tube fare to get to the station.
Yep, train tickets are ridiculous here. It kills me on the inside whenever I have to go to London.
Let’s hope nationalisation brings ticket prices down. I was happy to see the South Western is the first to be taken back.
Edit: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ceqg73znzzeo
The government cannot guarantee train tickets will get cheaper under renationalisation, as South Western Railway (SWR) was brought into public ownership on Sunday.
Oh well.
Seeing as government has directly set all ticket prices for the past 5 years, that’s not going to happen.
Rail prices in Britain are set largely to manage demand, as there is significant congestion. If tickets were reduced, too many people would try to travel at peak hours.
It’s also been the philosophy of every government since the 1950s that railways should fund themselves as much as possible, so central funding is lower than elsewhere.
I read on another thread the reason is the companies leasing the rolling stock are charging ridiculously high amounts, so the operators are running on tight margins.
For peak, I get it. But the off peak trains I was on were nowhere near capacity. So lower fares may have encouraged more people to use the train than the coach, which takes longer but is significantly cheaper.
In SF its a hundred dollars a month, but you can only go to 4 stations in the city, so you end up paying regular fare on top of that all the time, and usless for commuters.
The busses frequently dont exist even though google and the signs say they should be arriving, so youre frequently an hour or more late because you had to get an uber because the bus never came.
If youre going to a connecting train or flight you need to leave hours early to account for delays.
NYC is much more reasonable
Which 4 stations? Back when I was there before Covid I was paying the monthly bart card but I could go anywhere as long as it was Bart. Did that change?
bart is quite expensive, some people cant afford the muni fees, or dont want to so they just fare evade. the inspectors are extra aggressive in giving people the ticket, but many people will give fake details so it doesnt get sent thier house, NEVER give your ID that can identify you r personal details.
as long as there is no peace officer(police) you can just try to walk off the bus and exit on a stop they dont chase you. might be harder on a BART station though.
i wondered, who is this person who is so out of touch that she thinks that is a reasonable price, and… she is a former member of congress from orange county who is currently campaigning to be governor of california 🤡
I mostly agree with you but this is in one of the most expensive places in the country. Public transport should be free of course but everything must profit in the USA.
Toronto’s UP express checking in. $12.35 from down town to the airport. Sub way in the city is cheap and affordable but that dam airport thing is in its own world.
https://www.upexpress.com/en/about-up/things-are-looking-up
Next topic is toll roads. 407. Full there and back trip during main business hours. 274km = $173.50
Same in Edinburgh. The buses and trams have a capped fee per day but it doesn’t count if you’re coming from the airport for some reason…
It used to be more. Then someone pointed out it was more expensive than a cab from downtown to the airport.
