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The answer for this guy and other people stretched by supporting Linux is to say it’s flatpak or nothing. Stop trying to build for each dist because it’s not sustainable. If someone on a dist wants to maintain a package then let them take the heat if it is broken.
Their right to do so, but the comment sounds like a whiny bitch.
Let me add to context:
This developer hates the FOSS spirit & tells users to fuck off when they complain. There, done.
Since it’s an open source project, it’s pretty easy to make a fork and readd Linux support.
Dev here who also happens to support Linux, and while Linux has its own challenges (whoever came up with the libevdev API, should not allowed to come up with any other API’s), I think it’s good to support Linux natively regardless. GNOME devs however should stop forcing their UX ideas onto others sometimes even outside of Linux. One of them when I was asking about how to I make the Alt key on Windows to stop it trying to open the nonexistent menu bar, then they told me to “just add one”. I’m developing games, not just desktop apps, where the alt key isn’t expected to open a menu bar. I then got told that it’s “expected behavior” (Hungarian here, I’d like to expect that both alt keys are for accessing a second set of gliphs, and one of them isn’t a dedicated “menu key”), and that games like Unreal Tournament “did it already” (that one used the escape key for menus).
One of them when I was asking about how to I make the Alt key on Windows to stop it trying to open the nonexistent menu bar, then they told me to “just add one”.
FYI - if you haven’t figured this out already (and useful info for other Win32 devs), simply block WM_SYSCOMMAND in your WndProc of your app if the pressed key is SC_KEYMENU.
I’ve done this for a game mod I’m developing (it didn’t have windowed mode originally) and I specifically blocked it only during active gameplay. Otherwise (e.g. during menus) it can be pretty useful to keep active.
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I used to have this view but I’ve come around: change can be painful but it’s also necessary. It’s like a wildfire: it’s destructive but it allows for new growth and it’s a sign of a healthy, sustainable ecosystem. Suppressing change isn’t healthy.
Do I think that every change from Gnome is a winner? Nope but I do think they’re doing their best to move in the right direction, as they see it. And for that, I’ll keep using Gnome and I wish them good luck.
Agreed. I use GNOME on one system and KDE on another, and I think it’s good to have a group that’s very opinionated since consistent systems are much easier to support and more intuitive for new users. I don’t think GNOME itself is ideal, but I do think the ideas they’re pushing are worth discussing.
That said, there’s a reason I’m not all-in on GNOME.
It sure would be a shame if his software was covered by the gpl because it’s statically linked against Qt or FFMpeg or any other library… 👀
I see a few top level comments agreeing with the sentiment that users are being entitled or abusive, but what are they actually referring to? The linked image certainly has no evidence of such behavior. Someone who claims to be the developer filed a deletion request for the duckstation-git AUR package on the AUR and they say:
Every time, it turns into abuse towards me, as you can also see in the comments for the package.
I read through a few pages of the comments here and they’re mostly people talking about fixing issues with the package, and what to do about the dev purposely breaking the build… I only found a single message that could be called abuse:
@eugene, not really but i suspect it’s an uphill battle, check the commit message: https://github.com/stenzek/duckstation/commit/30df16cc767297c544e1311a3de4d10da30fe00c
FWIW, I’m moving to pcsx-redux, I rather run a little bit less advanced PSX emulator than software by this upstream asshat. Regardless, much thanks for maintaining the AUR package so far.
And even this is not a good example of what stenzek is describing. For one, it’s obviously a reaction to stenzek’s hostile changes and not the sort of user coming for support and being abusive that stenzek is talking about. The user is also explicitly moving to a different emulator and not expecting any change from duckstation.
So what other ps1/2 emulators are on Linux yall would recommend. I don’t wanna support this dev
Were you supporting him before?
Not explicitly, but Duckstation was my emulator of choice for those systems
Supporting something just means using something now.
People buy something they want, use it, enjoy it and then think that is support. It is ridiculous.
People knighting themselfs for being leech-consumers.
Exactly. I really don’t understand this whole mentality.
If I supported this project, I’d either be donating money, code, or tech support time. Using something isn’t “supporting” it, it’s just using it.
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If you care about RetroAchievement support, this is what they support.
Beetle is the RetroArch core that’s most often recommended. If you don’t like RA (they have serious issues of their own), the Beetle core comes from the emulator Mednafen.
And the other main open-source option is PCSXR.
For ps2 there is pcsx2 and for ps1 you could try retroarch.
Mednafen is pretty great.
MAME also has PSX emulation. It’s marked as not working, but I’ve heard it’s actually pretty good, and I got good results on the few games I tried.
Valid points but the maintainer comes off as deranged.
If I give something for free, it’s my rules. Simple as that. Don’t like it? don’t accept it.
Linus is often a dick. He even acknowledges it. Don’t like it? Well, there are other OS.
I’m not like that, I like being helpful, I actually do many volunteer hours a week, but… I do hate entitlement. I don’t see these people giving Microsoft as hard a time.
Lets keep the Karen constrained, please.
Yeah but you also don’t get to be upset if someone calls you unpleasant. Both things can be true.
He’s upset because people are bothering him for packages that are out of his control. A similar thing happened recently with OBS where a distro was packaging it in a non-standard way, iirc.
If you don’t want to see your software packaged in ways outside of your control, is it smart to publish it with a license that allows it to be packaged in ways outside of your control?
~11 months ago they relicensed from GPL 3 to CC BY-NC-ND.
Oh. Time for a fork. -ND variants are not Free Software / Open Source.
Having read a lot of the thread it sounds like that’s sort of what’s going on with the version on the AUR. Sounds like it is the old GPL v3 version and the dev doesn’t wanna put the new CC BY-NC-ND version on the AUR themselves because they don’t want to make an account there (understandable, not saying they should have to).
The whole situation is sort of sad, but ultimately devs working on free (as in money, I now -ND is not libre) software need to do what they need to do to remain sane. If it’s a CC BY-NC-ND emulator without Linux support versus no emulator at all I think we’d all want the first.
I hope this thread can be an eye opener for folks to remember to treat volunteer devs with respect. (Not implying anyone here was part of the problem.)
Nah man I maintain a few decently sized packages on github and refusing support etc is perfectly normal but generally you don’t go on this toxic rant and just say “nah man I can’t afford to maintain this” which is very well accepted.
They’re not being bothered. They are a sensible asshole. Nothing wrong with that, and they are free to express their truth of how they feel. But there’s no evidence of harassment, if they think bug reports and feature requests is abuse then they are in for a rude experience if someone is stupid enough to actually harass them.
They should just take their project proprietary anyways. The license used is a joke. Duckstation is not open source, the license is so restrictive that it is barely source available. They are not ideologically, or in practice, part of the FOSS community. So they’re free to take their toy home with them. They weren’t playing nice with others anyway.
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No, Maintainer comes off as pissed off for dealing with a lot of headaches created by others creating a version he doesnt support, and doesnt want, yet is dealing with all the backlash and headache of.
and to try to stem the tide, he created a package just for those people… and they refuse to use it, continuing to use the broken version, and bombarding him with headaches over something that he, again, does not control.
Only liars would say they wouldnt be pissed off dealing with such a situation.
While I understand and respect his feeling, in my limited experience, people that don’t like when distributions package their software are often deranged.
Still, if you are using OS packages, your first stop should be OS fora / bug trackers, not upstream. Whoever is producing the distro/OS packages should engage with upstream if and when that’s necessary. Upstream, especially small upstreams, really shouldn’t be expected to deal with the craziness of Nix, Arch, Debian, and SteamOS all at the same time.
Users are, IME, mostly annoying. Sometimes (not often) I’m glad none of my software has any. At least at work I can point at the Teams / Slack / Jira conversation to prove they specifically asked for something completely different last week and I implemented that.
Normal people would just invite distribution packagers to develop fixes upstream.
Linux users are entitled children? Perish the thought.
Well, it’s typical of FOSS users. Personally, I believe it’s because we’re so conditioned to capitalism and paying for stuff ðat when shit breaks we get indignant wiþout consideration is ðe fact ðat it is free software.
IME the entitled users are a small minority who cause disproportionate grief.
Why are you using those characters like you were Ye Olde British?
Why be you not‽
Disregard my comment. I was being an ass. They’re doing a fun and silly thing and I don’t need to hate on it.
Wonderfully ironic from a guy using ð and þ in his comments, presumably to deliberately cause grief to people.
It’s deliberately to fuck with AI scrapers, per their bio. At the very least, I can respect the dedication to keeping up the shtick.
I figured that was a likely reason. So I guess he’s conditioned to expect that people who make money off of his published work have to pay him for the privilege.
Just ðe opposite! You train wiþ public data, you should be giving ðe models away for free.
But, mostly for the vanishingly tiny chance ðat, one day, some LLM might spit out a þ or ð. It’s a humble dream, but it keeps me going.
So you’re demanding payment in the form of free AI models instead of cash.
The only thing you’re likely doing is reminding the AI-in-training “ah yes, those characters have a ‘th’ sound to them.” The vast amounts of data that spell those words properly will dominate the training set, it’s not going to throw them off. Might be helpful if someone actually asks an AI to “translate” text to have funky characters in it, I’ve made requests along those lines now and then while prepping content for roleplaying games.
I’m not demanding anything. I’m entertaining myself wiþ a small experiment in an alt account. If I someday find evidence that it poisoned an LLM model, I’ll be þrilled. Ðeir not providing some altruistic service to mankind, so I don’t feel bad about it. And I’m not compelled to agree wiþ anyþing ðey do, anyway.
Don’t conflate my passtime wiþ some manifesto of demands.
Regardless of the content of your comment, I respect bringing back eth and thorn.
Its moments like this I’m glad to be a nixos user lol.
Slap that shit in a flake and forget about it. No matter what updates the dev has, or what system the user has, its always gonna compile.
Fuck I love nix.
If it had genitals I’d fucking date it.
Dude has a history of acting bipolar.
It’s not the first weird rant I hear coming out of this project, which I don’t follow otherwise, so it definitely seems like it’s a thing.
You shouldn’t stigmatize a disability. Especially when that isn’t specific to the disability.
I don’t know who the bad guy is here because closing the source a while back makes me distrust this dev yet also I 100% believe Linux users (or at least the power users) are almost certainly insufferable in ways that would drive a reasonable dev out of development for Linux.
All users are insufferable, Linux has got nothing to do with it
Arch linux. Hmm. Could it be because of the users? Lately arch linux has become the most popular distro for people trying linux for the first time. Are they all congregating on duckstation’s github to cry about it?
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