I have used Arch for >13 years (btw) and use the terminal every single session. I also work with Linux servers daily, so I tried the other families with DEs (Debian/Ubuntu, RHEL/CentOS/AlmaLinux/Fedora).
I’m comfortable (and prefer) doing everything with CLI tools. For me, it’s a bit difficult to convert my Windows friends, as they all see me as some kind of hackerman.
What’s the landscape like nowadays, in terms of terminal requirements?
Bonus question: Which distribution is the most user-friendly while still updated packages? Does anything provide a similar experience to Arch’s amazing AUR?
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With Linux Mint you don’t need the terminal 99% of the time. The rest distros are close to 95% of the time. I always suggest Mint to new users.
Last time I set up Mint the only thing I needed the terminal for was to disable a setting on Java 8 that prevented it from launching on Xfce.
I didn’t need to use the terminal to do that, though. It just didn’t feel right editing a system config file with a GUI text editor.
Yes.
On Linux Mint, most updates and backups can be automated; installing ClamTK from Software Manager can be automated; the Software Manager, itself, is a GUI.
The terminal is helpful but required? Not really.
Generally you can use use the GUI with things like Nobara Linux.
But most software install instructions are all “copy and paste these commands”.
Yes.
After god knows how many years now of being on Linux exclusively, I tend to look at the terminal (commands in general) as a convenience more than a necessity. Meaning that in a lot of cases, knowing a command and quickly typing it to start an update (for example) is just faster and easier than pulling up the GUI every time.
All the “software stores” I have seen: ubuntu’s software center, flatpack are utter trash. Offensively bad. I’m not sure how you can even get the flatpack store without the terminal.
so, e.g. flatpak tells you to install flatpak via commandline on ubuntu. Apparently it’s built into linux mint.
https://flathub.org/en/setup/Ubuntu
but when trying to install a random app,
https://flathub.org/en/apps/app.curocalc.calculator/install
the instructions are to “download file and execute”, but my filebrowser doesn’t have a “execute this file” option in my right click and double clicking does… nothing? Certainly doesn’t give me a popup with either confirmation or error message.
I’m game to try a few more things, so if you have suggestions what I should try, please tell me.
I’m on xubuntu.
Flatpak is not a store, it’s a package format. Mint has a built-in “Software Manager” GUI app that allows you to browse Flathub and install flatpaks from there. On Xubuntu, I guess you’ll need to install gnome-software or Bazaar, or just the
flatpakpackage if you don’t care about using a GUIThis is one of those intentionally misinterpreting posts that I really really… “dislike” in the linux community.
I guess you’ll need to install gnome-software or Bazaar
…which the official instructions don’t mention, so it’s not a valid answer. Again, I can get it to work, but that’s not the topic of this thread.My intention wasn’t to misinterpret your post; I genuinely thought you were asking for help using flatpaks without the terminal on your Xubuntu setup. As for the topic of this thread, as a Bluefin user, I’d argue that we’re coming very close of being able to daily drive Linux without ever opening the terminal at all.
(also, the Flathub instructions page you’ve linked on your post do mention installing gnome-software)
That is technically true, but
Install GNOME Software Flatpak plugin
The GNOME Software plugin makes it possible to install apps without needing the command line. To install, run:
sudo apt install gnome-software-plugin-flatpakI hope you can see the problem with that.
It did read that page, it just didn’t register because it’s more command line stuff.
Not sure if this helps, but don’t you need to right click and under permission allow it to run as a program?
Then I can often just double click and run
That’s a good idea! but it doesn’t work for me.
Using Linux Mint, most of what I use I could without terminals if I wish. However, just like with Windows, terminal intervention will be needed sooner or later, usually to figure out why a given program isn’t working.
There’s a sysd GUI that you can use to look at logs. It’s much faster to just refresh the UI than searching your history for the right command
Exactly. You can get away without using the terminal on a lot of linux distros in the same way you can get away without using CMD on Windows… until one very specific thing breaks and suddenly it’s time to run
sfc /scannowfor the millionth time.I personally don’t understand why that command doesn’t run every time the system starts up by default, I wrote a script that ran it on startup years ago and I can’t tell you how many times it tells me that there were files that needed repairing.
I don’t know why you would want to use linux without the terminal? I mean, you can… but you’ll be limited if you want to do something special or fix a problem. It’s not like you have to know how to code or anything. Often you can copy the commands right into it… It’s really no problem.
People who have been using Windows their entire lives simply get intimidated
I know… but they do know how to copy and paste, and that’s what they need to be able to… Those I have told about it, in this way, are relieved and not afraid of it…
I really do think that’s their problem, and software shouldn’t cater to people who are afraid of checks notes typing. There can be real accessibility reasons why some users may require graphical tools due to various disabilities, but I don’t think it’s reasonable to feed into irrational fears of terminals when they can just copy paste in commands. It’s not programming, it’s very simple to understand the syntax of any command the average user might have to use (ie they’re not doing scripting or anything like that).
I think a lot of people are just scared because the terminal is so much more powerful than the gui. The gui won’t let you delete the system but the terminal is happy to let you. People shouldn’t be so scared but they are and I think the use of phones over PCs will exaggerate the problem.
The terminal lets you delete the system with the same checks as GUIs, i.e. you’d be prompted for a privilege escalation password… If you delete random user files in the terminal then you can do that in a graphical file browser too. Just don’t run random commands without knowing what they do.
As someone in this category : wtf? I kept using the terminal all the time when I was still on windows. From 95’s dos to 11’s cmd.
Sure, but then you’re definitely not an average Windows user. I’m trying to get normal people off it
Can confirm, I helped a friend put Fedora on their old laptop to give it life again. Even though I wrote them instructions, once it came time for the terminal stuff, they video called me, lol. They love using that laptop now, though! They were in their early 20s for reference.
I use both Fedora atomic (using cosmic DE) and Universal Blue’s Bluefin so I’m largely just getting on and doing things as software is Flatpak, updates are automatic and I use Box Buddy as the gui for distrobox (installing other architecture software). After years of terminal use I have found this way of working very liberating but know it’s not everyone’s cup of tea.
Less needed than on Windows.
As a Linux Mint user who has only used Linux Mint, Yes, I’ve hardly used the Terminal, I’ve really only used it to download & run specific Software which is really just optional most of the time.
Nope. Every Linux distribution I’ve used has needed access to command line at some point. If anything goes awry people will always give you steps how to fix it from command line.
Now I’m not saying all this couldn’t be done graphically, but you very rarely find steps that way.
I almost asked this exact question today. I installed Ubuntu (Studio) for the first time and almost immediately needed to do some CLI shit because there’s no GUI option to enable jumbo frames. I don’t want to learn CLI. I just want to escape Windows.
I don’t want to learn CLI.
But…like, why? It is less effort than it was to type out the entirety of your post. I will never understand.
It’s not, though. Tying a command doesn’t take a lot of time, but learning what commands are useful in a specific situation does. Even “ls -la” is an achievement you need experience for. And it doesn’t help that if you get stuck and ask (around here or in other enlightened circles) the answer you receive is usually some variant of “Have you read the 40-screen man page?”
That’s why –help exists
Again, though…why is that bad? Did you know how everything in Windows worked the first time you used it? Of course not. Why is this different? There are going to be growing pains to learning anything new. What’s wrong with reading the manual if you don’t know how something works? Isn’t that what they’re for?
Just for the record, these are not the same questions you asked in your first post. But to answer them: nothing is different about this. But at some people don’t want to keep learning how to use stuff, they want to start using it. And there’s a difference between “learn how to use a new vacuum cleaner” (to give a particularly obvious example) and “learn how to use a completely new paradigm that is different from everything you have used before and doesn’t have a clear starting point”. (And before you say that the first steps are easy, let me rename all commands in your CLI and see how quickly you find out how to read a man page.)
Mind you, I’m not talking about myself, having used CLIs since the 80s, but just because I know how to do something doesn’t mean it should be a fun activity for everyone.
But at some people don’t want to keep learning how to use stuff, they want to start using it.
That is impossible, then. I don’t know what else to say to it. You can’t use something without first learning how to use it. Life is learning new things, forever. We don’t know how to do anything without learning first, and in the age of the web learning something has never been easier.
And before you say that the first steps are easy, let me rename all commands in your CLI and see how quickly you find out how to read a man page.
If I wanted to do something, then I’d figure it out. I do this all the time in my work. I don’t know how every tool works, I don’t know how every environment fits together. I still don’t see how this is an argument for “I do not want to learn.”
I still don’t see how this is an argument for “I do not want to learn.”
Because this is just one thing that you clearly know how to do and probably enjoy.
I don’t know how many of the following things you are good at and enjoy, but the same argument applies to all of them: cooking, knitting, repairing a car, welding, growing crops. All of these are desirable and apply to things that most of us use regularly. But you just cannot expect everyone to learn them all in order to enjoy the products they could create or enhance by them. It is not problematic to say you just want to use something and not learn everything that is necessary to create or master it.
If you cannot see that this is true of a CLI, then I have run out of ways to try to explain it to you.
My gf and I are on Kubuntu. The only CLI she needs is to start her G13 kb, otherwise she is GUI only, even when I set up her machine it was all through GUI. Myself, I do CLI stuff cause it is often easier for me, lsblk/lsusb/mount broken ntfs drives(Ok this one I need after the occasional reboot til I get a new media drive), but I don’t NEED to use it except for my G13 kb and the broken ntfs drive for now. ymmv.
I know at least two people who have been using Ubuntu as a daily driver for years and have never (as in, ever) touched the terminal.
