• Hikuro-93@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    I really hope for once Congress does its job and MAGA actually fights him on this, since some have already been saying this is too much even for them, starting with the plane.

    Let it be on the record yet again that Trump does not have a luxury plane retrofitted with millions in taxpayer money - not because he refused the bribe, but because he was barred from accepting it. Refusing a bribe =/= Having a bribe forcibly taken from your hands.

    Let him not gain anything from it or this, but still have that ethic shitstain smeared all across his face as he tries to gaslight the world with his lies. Not that he wouldn’t try to claim that since he doesn’t have the plane, it means he “refused” it, or “it was a joke all along”.

      • woodsie@ani.social
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        2 months ago

        What are you on about? Are you just reading a word or two in these comments and arguing with the first thing you come up with? Because I don’t see how else you could miss their intended point so hard.

        • socsa@piefed.social
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          2 months ago

          It’s a pro Trump .ml troll who goes into every thread and rants about liberals and Democrats.

      • Hikuro-93@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Ok? What does it have to do with the fact that “Trump has opened the Presidency up for business/loves his bribes”? Feel free to narrow context outside of the point of my statement, as if either bribe is completely disconnected from the other, but the plane is still a really important catalyst for the rest - it’s what signals “Qatar quid pro quo, then Syria quid pro quo, then somewhere else quid pro quo”. I won’t even say “quid pro quo with anyone”, because that line is already being crossed right here with a terrorist, so that would be moot.

        Way more effective to cut the whole evil right at its root, where its most blatant, in order to stop the rest from spreading.

        • OBJECTION!@lemmy.ml
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          2 months ago

          Because it demonstrates that you’re not qualified to speak about foreign policy issues if you can’t even keep two very different countries straight. Much moreso when you don’t apologize and own up to it when it’s pointed out, but instead double down and say, “So what?” because anyone can make an error, but it only becomes a mistake when you refuse to correct it.

          This whole thread is full of people who were fully on board with funding Julani to fight Assad because the news told them Assad needed to go, only, they forgot they support him and saw a random tweet calling him a terrorist and only a handful of people were actually aware enough to remember who they support and push back on it. But you really took the cake, you really went above and beyond, by not even getting the country right.

          If this is the state of the American public’s awareness of countries like Syria (and it is), then pro-US leaders like Jolani obviously can’t rely on them, who will turn on them at the drop of a hat because they saw a random tweet calling them a terrorist. But I guess they’re in luck since the public has so little influence over policy. So naturally what they do is appease the ruling class, through lucrative deals and bribes.

          But who cares? So what if the post calls the US friendly leader of a precarious country a terrorist? So what if you mix up Qatar and Syria? So what if you talk nonsense grounded in willful ignorance because you can’t be assed to learn basic facts about countries the US has been fucking with, yet still expect people to listen to you? The important thing is, for a wonderful moment, you got to make fun of Trump.

          Liberals are approximately 10% less anti-intellectual than conservatives, which means they’re still extremely anti-intellectual, but don’t realize it because of how low the bar is.

          • StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            But they did keep them straight, you’re just misunderstanding their comment. It’s a little complex but it’s not unintelligible.

          • Doorbook@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            It’s insane the amount of comments about him accepting and making these bribes while the entire government for the last 50 years has been bought and sold with lobbyists and business owners. It is like he is the only one and not the entire Congress is behind this behaviour…

            • Hikuro-93@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              You are right. But here’s the key difference:

              while the entire government for the last 50 years has been bought and sold with lobbyists and business owners

              A President enriching others who support him (as opposed to “doing what’s best for the nation” generally speaking), while still wrong, is not the same as personally enriching himself and this blatantly. The US has always been like this and many would have loved to do what Trump is doing, but didn’t dare go this far and so recklessly. Trump is merely a product of his country, and it kind of surprises me it took this long for someone like him to get his paws directly on this kind of power.

              Instead of being a businessman currying favor with the President, he skips the middle man entirely and becomes President himself, to his own personal benefit.

              • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                2 months ago

                But hasn’t it been the case in many things that Trump just does more and more boastfully what others were doing before more quietly and slickly?

                I mean, look at the Israeli Genocide, were Biden was actively supporting Israel with guns and ammo (including sending 2000lb bombs which even the US Military won’t use “because they have a too large collateral”) but decorating it all with a bit of Theatre (“we’re talking to Israel about a cease fire”), or how students were already being violently suppressed by the police under Biden when they demonstrated against the Genocide, or the immigrant thing were Biden was already imprisoning and deporting the most immigrants ever (even than Trump’s first term) including separating children from their parents but it was all done much more quietly, or, as others pointed out, the Democrats having been on the take as much as the Republicans (who can forget Hilary Clinton getting paid half a million dollars for a couple of hours work to go give a speech to some Goldman Sachs’ traders just before the election, something which probably contributed to her loss), or the giant civil society surveillance apparatus as revealed by Snowden built-up and supported by both Republican and Democrat presidents.

                In these kinds of things Trump pumped up the volume and tore down the curtains hiding what’s going on in the backstage, whilst not really changing the nature of what is being done significantly, just doing more of it and being loudly about it rather than using some florid language to claim to be doing the opposite as the previous ones did.

                America had already been moving towards full-blown Fascism before Trump (personally I saw the giant civil society surveillance apparatus as a massive red flag, as that’s the kind of thing that Authoritarian regimes have, not Democracies),

          • Hikuro-93@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            First of all, not american, and me “mixing” them up is entirely another assumption of yours - which you are free to make, as I can’t control what you decide to think or how you interpret things, and that’s a-ok with me. I’m in fact considerably closer to Syria and Qatar.

            Secondly, this rather seems a personal and touchy subject to you, as your willingness to insult, dismiss and assume (ironically) indicates. This is further reinforced by your posting history, which clearly tells me you’re a very combative person who loves to disagree for the pleasure of it, and doesn’t mind spending a lot of time trying to one-up others disagreeing with you in any way, I assume with ego as a driving force. So with that in mind, no real point in arguing with you, right? Even though it would seem we’re mostly aligned when it comes to the bigger picture.

            So I hope whatever is going on gets better, but this is where I stop engaging in toxic rants, regardless of what you may think of me.

              • Hikuro-93@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                What? Where do I even hint that I would deny “Qatar’s human rights are of significant concern”? Or that I am surprised that Trump is accepting bribes?

                My statements on this matter have pretty much been: Trump openly takes bribes -> Trump should be held accountable -> Regardless of where the bribe takes place or from who it comes. And one commenter starts derailing it because “Hurr durr Qatar and Syria are not the same place”, while another goes “why are you denying Qatar has a human rights problem”, both of which don’t even come near the point I was making. Can’t we just agree what Trump is doing is wrong and not look elsewhere for excuses to nitpick and create chaos? Are the internet points for having “good obvious opinions” really that important?

                Literally nothing to do with defending wrongdoing from anywhere or trying to justify it- which is just twisting words to make them seem like something else and go from there to create needless drama - which in turn is why I ignored the other commenter in the first place.

                • OBJECTION!@lemmy.ml
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                  2 months ago

                  Your downvotes mean nothing to me because I’ve seen what you upvote.

                  Like seriously, the fuck makes you think I care if you think I’m an asshole? 800+ upvoted this post, all of those 800+ people were pretty objectively wrong to do so and demonstrated that they’re completely unqualified to speak about foreign policy, so I’m not at all surprised to get ratio’d in the comments or get called an asshole for pointing out that they’re wrong. Genuinely, could not care less what any of those 800+ people think of me, this community has clearly demonstrated its ignorance and I’m not going to pretend otherwise and pull punches just to farm upvotes.

                  Like, y’all call al-Jolani “a known terrorist” and then think your insults still carry weight when you call me an asshole?

  • Professorozone@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    Umm the burden is on the one making the claim. It’s also customary on the net to site the source so… No I didn’t.

    • Obinice@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      Okay, now that you’re past the initial outrage stage and able to think with a clear, focused head about this emergency, what action are you going to take?

      (Unless you’re not from the USA in which case my apologies)

      • The Quuuuuill@slrpnk.net
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        2 months ago

        you have to find balance. the holocaust survivors who taught me how to resist an authoritarian taught me you absolutely must rest, take time to take care of yourself and your family, and mourn your losses. but that period of rest must never be forever. you can’t survive if you simply choose to wait it out. but you also can’t survive if you break yourself fighting back early in the fight

          • Montagge@lemmy.zip
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            2 months ago

            Nah, the problem with the residents of the US is most think they can rest forever and someone else will do thework.

          • The Quuuuuill@slrpnk.net
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            2 months ago

            everyone everymorning everywhere, tbh. even if your world does not feel authoritarian today, it can tomorrow with just one charismatic power hungry sicko. they export their allies when their form of fascism dies off in a place. the nazis survived via operation paperclip. the neoliberal fascists that defined the last era of the century in our country were sent to Ukraine to “help” them. when the era of MAGA ends, their mid ranking terrorists will go to some other humanitarian disaster inflicted by one of the imperial powers that exists as their neighbor. always the host country welcomes them gladly because they’re on the brink of total devastation, but always these exports are snakes waiting to bite.

            when we the people are finally free, it will be because our inheritors figured out what we could not: there is no useful nazi. war is how they survive. they convince you you must give them some amount of power to thwart their allies at your gates. the only true cure for nazism comes from rejecting them from society entirely and never allowing them to form their own elsewhere.

            nazism is too dangerous to let survive.

        • Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org
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          2 months ago

          That’s his exact plan. At some point you have to tune out and focus on your own life, and he’ll still be there, just less visible and thus more dangerous.

          • Boomer Humor Doomergod@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            As if there’s any way to escape his stupid ass. The least political things in the world are talking about him. He’s unavoidable and he likes it that way.

            It’s more like the earpieces in Harrison Bergeron that keep you from having a complete thought.

  • confluence@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    My new conspiracy theory: Vance is a made man for the Technate, and the plan has always been to get him into the Presidency. Trump will be enabled to act as corruptly as he wants, until an impeachment succeeds. Vance will step in and fulfill Thiel’s program. Trump lands softly, and the Matrix is built.

  • BeBopALouie@lemmy.ca
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    2 months ago

    Americans will just get mad post on Reddit and then go back to watching YouTube, Twitch in the hovel of their choice until ice comes for them and they will say no no not me you said it was the “others”. They are not watching the news. Bills to make furries the bad guys. Bills to make 2SLGBTQIA+ bad guys. Starting to grumble(by grumble I mean “we need to outlaw this stuff” talk) about what should and should not be on Twitch and other platforms. Grumbling about gamers and certain games. The list of buried stuff in the bills that are coming out is staggering.

    They Came by Pastor Martin Niemöller

    First they came for the Communists
    And I did not speak out
    Because I was not a Communist
    Then they came for the Socialists
    And I did not speak out
    Because I was not a Socialist
    Then they came for the trade unionists
    And I did not speak out
    Because I was not a trade unionist
    Then they came for the Jews
    And I did not speak out
    Because I was not a Jew
    Then they came for me
    And there was no one left
    To speak out for me

    • Bongles@lemm.ee
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      2 months ago

      What do you propose?

      You’re not going to Luigi the guy, security is far tighter and he’s had a couple “attempts”. Protesting is happening and barely accomplishing anything. The judicial system is doing more than i expected but he’s ignoring it in many cases. Congress WILL NOT impeach him unless there’s a switch in party majorities but that’s a ways off.

      • okgurl@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        I often ask this too non Americans foolishly assume we aren’t doing anything. the problem is that, or system is strategically designed to give us the illusion of a voice. same with the right to bear arms, if the state was ever worried about those arms being aimed at them we wouldn’t have a service amendment.

        there’s nothing really left to do with corruption actually the upper echelon, besides fed posting teir stuff which is unrealistic for many people.

      • BeBopALouie@lemmy.ca
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        2 months ago

        I am not an american. All I know is if citizens just keep doing nothing the us will become just like the fascists in Germany did in WWII. It is up to them to do something or nothing. Time will tell.

    • OBJECTION!@lemmy.ml
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      2 months ago

      First they came for the sanctions against a country on the opposite side of the world 😔

  • p3n@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    I am not arguing with the obvious corruption, but to provide a counterpoint to the second part of the argument: if we aren’t allowed to make peace with former terrorists, then we can never stop fighting each other, and if we keep fighting each other, then we will keep creating the next generation of terrorists.

  • NoMadLadNZ@lemmy.nz
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    2 months ago

    Imagine Obama or Biden, or Harris, doing this!

    Everything about this is like we have all been force-fed industrial strength hallucinogens. That YMCA played by the murderous Saudi prince after that fawning display… WTAF world are we living in any more?

    If this was the Matrix I’d be demanding to be unplugged right now, and promptly throw up on the floor

  • Lorem Ipsum dolor sit amet@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    The sanctions on Syria should be lifted, but WTF. I mean honestly. It will be interesting to see what Israel does from that as they generally want Syria destabilised. Could further add to the rift between Netanyahu and Trump.

    • ℍ𝕂-𝟞𝟝@sopuli.xyz
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      2 months ago

      Yeah, this, the Saudis getting closer to him and the Quatari plane gift sounds like he’s slowly realising the Arabs in general have more money while he’s perhaps the one politician in the US who is immune to the AIPAC trying to primary him. And I would guess Israel hasn’t even said thank you.

    • technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      2 months ago

      It will be interesting to see what Israel does

      Interesting? I’ll predict the future right now: The zios will continue to invade, murder people, and steal land.