TLDR - what’s the question mark in the following scale

Cult(-1)……………….Religion(0)……………….???(+1)

Long version (a.k.a my stupid mind’s question that is keeping me awake):

My understanding of cult is a group of people with an absurd or even possibly nefarious belief system. Like something negative.

By that definition I would put religion in the middle (though a majority of it leans towards the cult side). A group of people that is very serious about what they believe in, no matter how illogical it is.

So with this understanding what would you call the positive side ? A group of people coming together to have a tradition and belief system just for the fun of it ? Is there such thing ?

  • cam_i_am@lemmy.world
    18·
    6 months ago

    Community.

    They’re all groups of people with some kind of shared purpose or values. Cults are harmful and power based. Communities are helpful and consent-based. Religions can fall either way, or somewhere in the middle.

    • fishos@lemmy.worldEnglish
      3·
      6 months ago

      This or “support group”. Community implies those already around you. Something like AA would fit the bill for something that is similar to religion or a cult but positive and affirmative.

      • cam_i_am@lemmy.world
        2·
        6 months ago

        Support groups for sure, but I was more thinking of things like sporting clubs, dog parks, skate parks, artistic communities, soup kitchens, men’s sheds, book clubs. Third spaces.

        Anything where participation is voluntary, hierarchy is absent or minimal, and people come together to share interests, resources, time, or company.

        • LockheedTheDragon@lemmy.world
          11·
          6 months ago

          Any group can become a cult, because cults are systems of control. Loosely organized groups are going to have a harder time becoming one, but sporting club which probably have rules and hierarchies, a soup kitchen is probably a nonprofit so would need rules and leaders. Artistic communities may have rules to use the space. Any group can become authoritarian if they get structured enough.

          • cam_i_am@lemmy.world
            1·
            6 months ago

            Rules and leaders don’t have to be harmful or coercive though. Even very egalitarian communities need norms. Hell even an anarchosyndicalist commune will have some shared set of expectations of its members.

            Like you said, cults are about control. I have a hard time seeing much of a parallel between the necessary structure and norms of a community or club, and the coercive nature of a cult.

            • LockheedTheDragon@lemmy.world
              1·
              6 months ago

              “Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.” Rules and leaders are needed, but they always have the chance of being misused. That why checks and balances are always needed.

              You have the normal rules and norms, but what if you take them to an absurd level. Let’s say your in a Club. It has a rule that only members allowed and every member has to dress nice and be clean and presentable at all times inside. Well one member falls into the food table, getting food all over them and breaking their leg. Does the manager of the Club demand the person who fell get up and leave immediately? After all they are no longer clean and presentable. Well a reasonable Club would care more about having the person not move and getting emergency services in there. A cult would demand they get up and leave. The emergency personnel wouldn’t be allowed inside anyway since they are not members.

              I see the parallel because I see cults as normal behaviors taken to the extreme.

      • LockheedTheDragon@lemmy.world
        11·
        6 months ago

        AA could be a cult. Synanon which was a drug rehab organization became a cult. A lot of cults start out as positive and affirmative groups.

  • weariedfae@sh.itjust.works
    52·
    6 months ago

    ITT: no cult scholars. I am not one either.

    I watch a lot of Knitting Cult Lady’s content and I’ve read her book. From that I have a pretty good idea of what a cult is, which is an extreme form of group.

    So I guess the opposite of a cult would be a solitary individual.

    One point I keep seeing in these comments is religion. Religion isn’t a cult, it’s an idea. That ideology can be used by cults, but the idea itself isn’t a cult. You can believe the idea all by yourself you don’t HAVE to be part of the group.

    Yes [insert religious group you’re thinking of] is probably a cult. But it isn’t one because of the idea, it’s one because of controlling behavior and exploited labor and a bunch of other reasons.

  • zonnewin@feddit.nlEnglish
    6·
    6 months ago

    Intellectual freedom, with an appreciation of philosophy and scientific inquiry.