Was recently banned from a whole bunch of DB0 communities for, as best as I can gather, downvoting once when I viewed by All (potentially accidentally while scrolling).
Important notes:
- I don’t use scripts.
- I don’t mass-downvote Communities. If I see a post I generally don’t like when browsing All, I may downvote one post, block the Community and move on.
- Some of the communities I was banned from don’t have any posts in them so I wouldn’t have been able to downvote anything.
- Of all of these Communities, in my history I downvoted one post in one of them. Voting in this manner is not vote manipulation. It’s quite literally a feature of the platform and as a mod of another Community, I would consider it pretty good etiquette.
- One of my bans reads “Appeal Granted, not a brigading member” but I’m still banned.
- I don’t troll.
WTF is going on here?
EDIT - Updated Info from the conversation below: In the initial image, you can see two “ban waves.”
The 10 bans three months ago stem from a single downvote in one Community. It was @Draconic_NEO@lemmy.dbzer0.com See here: https://discuss.tchncs.de/post/34853477
I was called out by name for a single downvote and culled from a score of Communities I did not participate in by them.
The other bans from two months ago are from four total downvotes over a 10-month timeframe in one Community.
I have also stated in this thread that I don’t have issues with AI-gen images, but there are shoddy ones and well-done ones.
EDIT 2: Now unbanned from the ten Communities listed as “3 months ago” in my initial image, but have been banned from three more because of this thread with the reason given being “self-proclaimed anti-AI brigader” which are two things I didn’t claim to be. God dammit Lemmy…
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i have no idea what’s happening and im not sure why im even subbed to this one
i dont care about votes or bans.
no idea what ai has to do with any of this either.
but hey while we’re on the subject, i dont like how ai is being used in our culture in general and its pretty cringe to defend that.
i like gardening. i did yoga in my garden today. i made friends with a bird.
hope you all have a nice day, it’s just internet memes guys
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I’m a moderator on !stable_diffusion_art@lemmy.dbzer0.com, where you’ve never upvoted once, but you have downvoted multiple posts over months instead of blocking the community. This down-ranks submissions, adversely affecting the visibility of the community for subscribers, which is why you were banned.
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/28218497
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/35031819
I don’t understand the thought process here. Like many, I don’t browse Communities individually, I browse /All and sort by New.
So I am required to see something I like and upvote or else I am not allowed to an express an opinion in the community (or any tangentially linked community)?
If I see something I don’t like (which is what the voting system is for), I should go to the Community it’s posted in and make sure to upvote things before I downvote? That’s the expected order of operations?
If not… what if, while browsing /All /New nothing randomly appears that the viewer likes enough to upvote? Is that then somehow the fault of the viewer and they should then be banned?
Am I interpreting your rulings correctly? 4 downvotes in the span of 10 months (judging by the times on those posts you listed) is a bannable offence? Seems rather heavy-handed to me.
You don’t have to like anything, but consistent downvoting like this without any other kind of participation is indistinguishable from targeted downvote harassment, and isn’t consistent with your claims of blocking.
It’s perfectly distinguishable unless you’re trying real hard to misinterpret what I said. As a Mod of a small Community myself, here’s the difference in downvotes:
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Bad Faith Actor: Sees a post or a whole Community they don’t like. Goes in and systematically downvotes a bunch of stuff on purpose. Topics, responses… everything. Downvotes because they hate the community and everything it stands for. See 50 downvotes in your Community in one day? That’s these fuckers. Ban them. They are assholes and are vote manipulating. Probably ban them from related Communities for vote manipulation.
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Normal User: (–> We are here) May or may not comment in YOUR Community, especially if it’s image-based. Sees a single post that they don’t like out of thousands they see daily and downvotes it. Several months later, it may happen again. This is expected behaviour and is how an upvote / downvote system functions. Don’t ban these or you’re the asshole.
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Brigade Users: A coordinated attack to downvote or spam a Community stemming from some other place. They downvote everything and often post garbage. Ban these people. They are assholes and are vote manipulating. Probably ban them from related Communities for vote manipulation if not trying to seek an instance ban.
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Lurker: (The overwhelming majority of users are this) Indistinguishable from a Normal user in votes, but may not comment. May be an alt or bot account. Be wary. Check their post history to see if they’re real people. If real, leave 'em alone. If empty, use your discretion. Don’t ban from related Communities.
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Other: Downvotes accidentally when scrolling sometimes. These happen. May appear as a Lurker or a Normal User. Don’t ban these or you’re the asshole.
Hope that helps!
Yeah, you make really good points, but we get also get the kind of bad faith actor that browses all and downvote community content whenever they see it.
Okay… but that has nothing to do with the matter at hand. By your own admission, this user only voted negatively four times over the course of nine months. That clearly doesn’t fit the picture you’re trying to paint here. If that constitutes brigaiding, that leaves no room for normal use.
And just so we’re clear, I have been downvoting you within this thread, and that is owed entirely to the contents of your responses, as they’ve been conflicting, nonsensical, and overall harmful to the community.
Just one more for the road since I think the thread is dying down and I don’t like leaving things on a negative note.
It takes some bravery to dip into a thread discussing issues and I wanted to say thanks for clearing what you did up. I may not agree, but I can understand it at least. It’s important to remember the human on the other end. Moderating can be hard, and so can finding the line you feel you should walk. Thanks for running a Community on Lemmy. Shit’s not easy sometimes.
Just FYI, I’m not downvoting you.
The bad faith actors should be somewhat easy to pick out. They are in my Community anyway. They often have scads of downvotes they throw out in a short time, not a few over the course of months. Dunno if you are, but if you’re using automation to ban, you may just want to tune it to be a little more lenient.
Downvotes because they hate the community and everything it stands for.
If the community is promoting misinformation or hate then I would hope this is considered the right thing to do.
Maybe. Just I case, I wouldn’t interact. I would report it to an Admin most likely.
From what I’ve seen, most Admins will either not let that stand or sadly lead the charge on the psycho shit.
If it’s the first, you’re good. It’ll be gone soon.
If it’s the latter, get the hell outta that instance and block it.
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OPs story keeps changing so much.
“Oh I was unfairly banned”
“Oh I only downvoted 1 post”
“So what I only downvoted 4 posts”
Still nope. Geez, you are really dedicated to thinking the worst thing you can about people, hey?
I didn’t say unfairly banned. I was confused as to why I was banned.
I did downvote one post near the time of the ban. I didn’t look prior to that. 4 posts downvoted in ten months isn’t normally something I’d associate with a ban. People don’t generally ban for things that happened ten months ago. Especially since the votes were reasonably more private back then.
It’s all one story. The same story. It evolved as I discovered more about what occurred. It’s called learning. Make an attempt to do so as well please.
votes were reasonably more private back then.
Not commenting on anything else in your comment except to say: Votes have never been private on Lemmy. The have been made more visible, but they were always just an API call away.
Oh, I’m aware, but they weren’t as exposed as they are since 19.10 made them easily visible to Mods. It was MUCH harder to get downvote totals prior.
I don’t know why people browse like that in the first place. Of course you’re going to see a lot of crap. Why not subscribe to communities with content you enjoy?
I subscribe and am usually filtersd to subscriptions but also switch to All occasionally to help discover new communities.
This isn’t Reddit where there is a firehouse of content all day and at all times.
For doom scrollers such as myself, browsing all is a requirement.
Personally, I use that as a cue that I should put my phone down and do something useful.
If I see something I don’t like (which is what the voting system is for), I should go to the Community it’s posted in and make sure to upvote things before I downvote? That’s the expected order of operations?
If the community is about something you dislike (which seems to be the case here), why would you not just block them from your feed instead of downvoting?
Maybe I’m indifferent to the majority of the content they spew but there is one really shitty post that I down vote that isn’t worth blocking the feed over.
Keep in mind that the pattern that resulted in the OP being banned from over a dozen communities was down voting a single post. That would be triggered if the one post they down voted was literal spam or racist or sexist or any other terrible subject.
Or someone accidentally clicks on the down vote button with their fat thumb unintentionally. The mod assumes malicious intent and overreacts.
I wonder if the “overreaction” was caused by the constant harassment from anti genAI trolls? You helped create this situation, the mods are simply trying to deal with it. Sometimes that’s unfortunately going to result in erroneous bans, which can usually be resolved by DMing the mod.
I have yet to see an example of any individual post getting more than a handful of downvotes, which is completely expected to happen when hundreds or thousands of users have the opportunity to come across the content. That isn’t harassment, and neither is people vocalizing their dislike of AI in comments.
If people are being harassed, then there should be moderation records, right? Are there dozens of people harassing people who like AI, or is the ‘constant harassment’ just disagreement that has been blown out of proportion by people who run communities that don’t get the attention they think they deserve?
My one vote per post or comment is jot part of any problem. That is how voting works. I don’t coordinate with anyone else, it is just me using a feature that exists the way I want to.
I have yet to see an example of any individual post getting more than a handful of downvotes, which is completely expected to happen when hundreds or thousands of users have the opportunity to come across the content. That isn’t harassment, and neither is people vocalizing their dislike of AI in comments.
If people are being harassed, then there should be moderation records, right? Are there dozens of people harassing people who like AI, or is the ‘constant harassment’ just disagreement that has been blown out of proportion by people who run communities that don’t get the attention they think they deserve?
My one vote per post or comment is jot part of any problem. That is how voting works. I don’t coordinate with anyone else, it is just me using a feature that exists the way I want to.
I accept you are capable of being an asshole all by yourself, requiring no coordination.
Oh, we get to throw insults around? Didn’t think that was the case but have fun I guess.
Just pointing out that every time this has come up in YPTB it is an overreacting mod hiding behind the ‘anti AI harassment or brigading’ while the explanation is a few people happened to downvote a few things. I don’t doubt there have been a few people doing that, but absolutely not enough to justify Draconic Leo’s moderation log filled to the brim with accusations of bote manipulation. Pointing things out isn’'t sealioning, nor is having a conversation in the comments of the same post.
Here you go though, what comment(s) in my moderation or posting history are harassment?
The answer is none, the accusation in the bans is a lie.
On the other hand, if you’ve found a bunch of stuff worth downvoting and not a single thing worth upvoting, that’s probably a sign.
Keep in mind that the pattern that resulted in the OP being banned from over a dozen communities was down voting a single post.
Nah, it turns out OP has downvoted multiple posts in the comm over time. Somebody posted records elsewhere in this thread
Four downvotes across months means absolutely nothing. Nada. It is a statical blip.
Nah, feel free to downvote. But to go into that same community and just downvote every single post is not cool. Not only that, some people go to that same community every day to keep downvoting every single post. Regardless of content. And some, in my personal case, go to other comms I run and do the same thing, even tho they are totally unrelated posts and unrelated subject manner.
I’m not saying you did that, but it’s happening so much, that you probably just got caught up in it. If you really want to get back into those comms, email the mod.
I appreciate you sharing such a bonkers policy so plainly and candidly, but that makes it no less bonkers.
I’m open to feedback.
Basically what Spankmonkey said.
Stop doing your stupid policy because it is stupid.
Doing widespread bans and accusing people of ‘Vote Manipulation’ just because they down voted without joining or making a comment is making a mockery of the moderation process. Like maybe a few of the people you banned were doing that, but the vast majority were probably just served up the same post in All around the same time and decided it was slop and down voted it.
Why do those people care of they are banned from “Ai slop” comms then ?
If they weren’t putting accusations of vote manipulation and other ridiculous claims in the modlog it wouldn’t be nearly as annoying.
It also adds some annoying steps to the end user who would want to block those communities since banning means you can’t just click on the post and block the community in the default browser interface. Once banned it is necessary to go to setting and block the community manually.
Since they made a bunch of tiny, barely used communities it also means that they trickle into the feed and you have to block each one individually. They are spamming AI communities and then being dicks about it.
Then there is at least one that expands this to other communities they mod that don’t have anything to do with AI. I like the Dem TankieJerk, but got banned for not liking AI. Not harassing, just down voting one or two AI slop posts in some other community and not feeling bad about it.
At the end of the day it’s up to community mods how they want to moderate their communities. If they don’t want someone with a moderation history like yours in their communities then I can totally understand that. It’s not like db0 is the only instance where you’ve been banned for systematic down voting, now is it matey?
Acting like my moderation history is accurate when shitty mods treat a few downvotes as manipulation is the biggest part of the problem. You are taking their word for it that their moderation is accurate when it is not. The list is long because one mod did like a dozen of them at the same time.
That is the perfect example of why this is a problem!
The other one is jet at hackernews who has a bot that bans people for a single downvote and he has bragged about it right here in YPTB! Some of those bans are cross instance because they mod communities on multiple instances and banned all of them. It is the action of three or four ridiculously over the top mods.
It’s like talking to a wall.
I feel like sending a PM would have been a more decent and human thing to do. It’s an overstep to ban people who may disagree with the kind of art you are producing.
I feel like sending a PM would have been a more decent and human thing to do.
I used to think that, too. But I sent a PM to someone about this very subject once because I didn’t wanna ban them. He replied that PM’ing him was one of the most pathetic things he’d ever seen in his life and said I was an idiot. Maybe a one-off.
Ok, so another person was giving me issues and stalking me and downvoting everything I posted (I’m not well-loved on Lemmy haha), I PM’d them and said I didn’t wanna ban them, but downvoting across all my comms was in bad taste. He told me to fuck off and that he could downvote anything he wanted to.
Lesson learned. Way too many people on Lemmy who don’t like your attitude or views, are freakin crazy. As in stalk you crazy. One person, whom I won’t name (and admin here knows their name!), would regularly write to admins with pages of “proof” about how terrible I am for Lemmy. And why the outrage? I voted third party in the election. LMAO
Now I have no problem banning problem children without notice. The crazy on Lemmy is a whole 'nother level of crazy. lol
What I don’t get, is why the serial downvoting? If ya don’t like a community, just block it. But some refuse to block and just go in and downvote every single post. It’s happening more and more.
Not saying OP did that, but it’s happening. And we can see it happening because as mods, we are able to see the names of downvoters. Other people in this thread are noticing the same thing, so it’s not just me saying that.
The best move is to remove them and not engage.
These people wont’ reflect and suddenly become good members of the community.
where you’ve never upvoted once, but you have downvoted multiple posts over months instead of blocking the community
So am I supposed to keep track of random communities when I downvote stuff on my /all feed over months? That is an insane policy.
No, you’re expected to block communities you aren’t interested in. Curate your feed/all.
And I do. But there is plenty of communities that I am interessted in, just not in the AI content. So I won’t block them and and I will downvote the stuff I don’t like. Like you’re supposed to do.
This sounds really asinine unless I’m missing something.
You say that you’re not interested in ai content, but you do not block communities that have exclusively content that you are not interested (like ai).
And you down vote posts that you don’t like, so if there is a community that has a type of content that you do not like, you only ever downvote them when something of them appears in your feed.
Which is harmful to that community and the people who do like the content of that community. And you believe that we’re supposed to do this? I can’t believe that we’re supposed to be harming communities that we have no interest in. The kind thing to do, would be to leave them alone.
Just block them and you won’t have to see their posts and their votes won’t be disturbed by you. Different people enjoy different things, live and let live and all that.
You say that you’re not interested in ai content, but you do not block communities that have exclusively content that you are not interested (like ai).
That is incorrect.
Sorry, I had misread.
There have been frequent brigades of late in ai communities by anti-AI folks.
Your downvote likely coincided in timing and appeared as part of another downvote brigade.
Wouldn’t one glance at my long-standing profile and the fact that it was only a single vote made out of the nearly a dozen communities that I was banned from indicate that I’m not part of a brigade?
Not when you’re using AI to silence criticism of AI. Laziness and ineptitude are a feature not a bug.
Wut?
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I’d say that it was the dozen communities that made it seem like it was a brigade, as well as an attempt to avoid getting caught by only having one each across a dozen communities.
Edit: a whole word was missing.
And this is exactly why the fediverse needs private voting.
fediverse needs no voting
So brigading small communities can be easier?
Eh. I see arguments both ways. Public votes makes it easier to catch bad faith (downvote bots) and manipulation. However, it allows abuse from touchy or unscrupulous mods. TBH, I’m personally more concerned with the bots. Everything is federated to one can pickup and move elsewhere of they’re on the receiving end of such a mod.
If one becomes active on another instance with the same name it is highly likely the same mods will just ban the other user account too, so moving isn’t helpful.
Oh, I meant that one can start a new community on the new instance to remove the problematic mod from the picture. Not that one should try to engage in ban evasion.
When you assume a single downvote is brigading…
Across multiple communities, all the same subject, a singular downvote in each…
Obviously this is just my guess, but that’s what I would probably think based on what’s been going on.
Edit: Boy oh boy, you must be one of the anti-AI folks doing the brigading. You are super mad about this all over the place.
Snoogums is correct, there was one downvote in one of those Communities, not in multiple. It was not in any way vote manipulation or brigading. Apologies if you’re reading something else, but I felt I was being quite clear with my wording.
My mistake then, it read (to me) like you were saying you down voted once, in each of the communities you were banned from.
Then all I could guess was timing. Multiple communities might depend on what client they are using, but in any case a single downvote to a ban rings as mod silliness to me, I agree.
Hit the nail on the head matey.
I’m shocked. Shocked, I tell you.
Actually, if you read the post they said it was a single down vote, not one for each community. They even said some of the communities don’t even have a single post to down vote.
- Some of the communities I was banned from don’t have any posts in them so I wouldn’t have been able to downvote anything.
- Of all of these Communities, in my history** I downvoted one post in one of them**
You are ‘guessing’ the opposite of what actually happened, which is consistent with other dbzer0 AI fanatics who treat a single down vote as brigading.
Thats not how their reply reads to me, but your attitude and responses dont interest me. So I’ll be done from here, enjoy your day.
I will continue to enjoy it, thanks!
Would’ve had a lot more respect for you if you’d just been able to admit you were wrong when confronted with the evidence, but this type of “everyone’s dumb beliefs are valid” response is the cause of a whole host of other problems so clearly that was too optimistic.
Nah, just have no interest in people who behave like babies.
Your respect means nothing to me in any way, so… enjoy not having any for me I guess?
no interest in people who behave like babies.
You have no interest in yourself?
Db0 has unhinged mods, and an admin that doesn’t give a shit about it. Simple as.
You mean the admin who built fediseer and threativore and a bunch of other tooling to enable a better lemmy experience for everyone, and has run one of the most popular lemmy instances for years? The same admin who introduced radical recalls to allow instance members to vote out mods they don’t like, and encourages community voting for all new policies? Sure bro, if you say so. But why are you even here if you think that?
The guy you’re replying to needs to show some evidence, but do you have more than a paragraph of your thoughts to back up any of your claims?
Radical Recalls: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/38328295
Public Vote Banning Twitter Links: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/36484194
Threativor: https://t.lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/lemmy.dbzer0.com/35557475
Governance Community: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/35725820
What claims?
Edit: The claims of harassment and bullying? Yes, see here: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/43560521
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fediseer which is basically “get approved by me or people I approved, or get fucked”
they basically have absolute power in this system
I love it when anti-AI trolls act all confused about why they’ve been banned.
Actually, I’ve been unbanned from 10 of those subs due to this post because it was found to be an unjust ban. Also, are you able to point at the part where I stated I was anti-image generation, or are you just being standard-issue internet hostile?
“Create more slop” is, in fact, a message I disagree with rather strongly
you’re anti-AI, so YDI. fuck off to whatever liberal shithole you came from.
Do you have a fetish for weird images? Maybe it’s the extra fingers that does it for you?
Voices guard the arts— code invades the sacred brush, progress meets protest.Or you may just be addicted.
https://internetaddictsanonymous.org/internet-and-technology-addiction/signs-of-an-addiction-to-ai/
Wheels spin in silence— even the moon waits softly. Let the stillness speak.That’s pretty weird from you. I’m glad we have different opinions.
??? being anti-ai is liberal now?
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no no, you don’t understand, they are the Good Ones. And anyone else who isn’t 100% in agreement with them is the Bad People.
I just block the comms I don’t care about, can recommend.
Including that AI generated low effort crap. I don’t get the point of sharing that stuff, when you can generate your own if you want. But nowadays I don’t get many things anymore.
That mods/admins can even see who is downvoting is, by far, my least favorite thing about Lemmy.
Disabling downvotes can avoid such drama. Some instances do.
Rare to see a beehaw user so far away from spawn.
How did you reply to them? I thought beehaw defederated LW
Maybe they just don’t see my reply, then.
Beehaw is defed from world, but not vice versa, so when a DB0 community announces a beehaw comment it sends it to world who accepts the comment. The Beehaw user won’t be able to see the reply though.
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Reading this: https://helge.codeberg.page/fep/final/fep-1b12/
Would LW blindly trust that the object in thewait nvm, beehaw has auth-fetch off.announceactivity exists? I assumed it would try to fetch it to verify it, and beehaw would refuse to serve it
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Db0ero is explicitely pro AI
I would guess the Mod has gone full shizo and banned you from the whole instance and everywhere he could because you downvoted an AI generated image.
It’s dbzer0, and that’s the instance this comm is hosted on. So no, none of the Admins of the instance “went schizo”.
Looks like a mod of multiple comms maybe.
I never said admin.
You said “banned you from the whole instance”, which isn’t something a moderator can do. Only admins can do instance wide bans, moderators are limited to bans from their own comms.
It wasn’t unreasonable to think you were mixing up moderator and admin. Plenty of people did during the first reddit exodus, and still do.
When you see a wall of bans from a dozen communities it looks nearly identical to site wide bans.
Don’t use ableist language in a community where both of the mods are neurodiverse.
It’s annoying that the amount the general public cares about schizophrenic people is often less than they care about changing the words they speak.
sidenotes - CW: R-slur, used non-casually
This is common with a lot of disability-related terms, I expect this usage to decrease over time similar to how usage of ‘retard’ has.
I am unsure whether [‘schizophrenic people’ or ‘people with schizophrenia’] is correct here, I am going based off of what I have heard about [‘autistic people’ vs ‘people with autism’] as I could not find relevant information online.
The “person-first” formation is debated. Some people like it, some don’t. I think most people don’t care. I would assume, like most similar things, it was started by someone with only a tangential connection to the subject.
Yeah, the other way is identity-first and autistic people tend to prefer identity first. It does and should differ from minority to minority.
Have you considered perhaps not just saying the r-slur.
EDIT: see below comment
I don’t say that either.
You… Literally said it in your post. Big fucking shock to my system.
original comment, see edit first
are you kidding me
EDIT: I was confused by her saying ‘post’: I think she’s referring to my usage in the sidenote, which was intended as an example of [slurs towards disabled people that are no longer used], whereas I thought she was saying that I used them casually.
I don’t think discussing slurs is harmful to society in the same way that using them directly (as an epithet) is.
Despite this, I understand some people have strongly-negative reactions to seeing them, so I have added a content warning to the section.
Your edit is correct
I dont think its harmful to society, no, but as you say, some people have strong negative reactions to hearing or seeing them. Appreciate you changing it.
well most people with schizophrenia dont really consider themselves schizophrenic. it takes a lot of work to even get to that point of recognition. so you’re really looking for ways to destigmatize the experience of psychosis in general to encourage people to be open to acknowledging it and not worrying about all the social repercussions of being “crazy” and just be willing to find another explanation for the bizarre experiences theyve been having . unfortunately the very definition of delusion is that it persists in the face of evidence to the contrary! and to think that one’s beliefs have no ground in reality. it’s a lot to swallow!
honestly the best way to phrase it would probably be something like “had a break from reality” or similar
Ew what, I didn’t know this. I always just saw them as the anarchist friendly instance and I blocked all the ai communities so I guess I didn’t notice the correlation. Thats actually dissapointing
Oh no the transphobic genocide deniers are disappointed!
Lol.
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yeah, it was. do you wanna cop a ban too? cause if you use that sort of language here, I bet you’ll get one as well.
if you’re the sort of person who thinks using that sort of language is fine, then we won’t be losing anything worthwhile.
I don’t use it, but I also believe context obviously tells you that it was meant as a bad choice for “crazy” / “obsessive” and not a discrimination against those people
No need to minimod and taunt
Ah, the good old “ignorance is an excuse”. Too bad it’s bullshit, huh?
Why would you always assume the worse? That’s a great way to get offended at anything and to easily censor people while only giving your narrative
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@unruffled@lemmy.dbzer0.com - keep going mask-off.
Ban me too, cripplebrain. I am Spartacus.
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My pleasure
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I don’t make it a habit of downvoting images simply because they’re AI-gen, but there are well-done ones and horrible ones just like any images. Do they really ban for simply downvoting ANY AI image? That’s… kind of a lot.
No, they don’t, at least not the site wide admins.
This community is part of dbzer0, so if you were banned from the instance you wouldn’t be able to post here either.
It looks like you pissed off on moderator of a bunch of comms and they banned you from all of theirs. Based off another commentor’s link, this seems to have happened when those comms were being hit by waves of drive by downvoting so you may have been caught in the cross fire.
What is ‘drive by down voting’?
People (or bots) who go through a thread or comm and just downvote everything without otherwise engaging with the thread or comm.
It personally doesn’t bother me, but I can see why some find it distasteful.
that should teach ya
Yes, a few of the mods will ban anyone who downvotes AI or misinformation without making a comment or because you downvoted ‘too many times’ or some other bullshit. My ‘systemic downvoting’ and ‘anti-ai harassment’ community bans are for downvoting a few posts and not being sorry about it.
i discovered i have several community bans for being an anti-ai troll. i find that so odd because like… i’m not trolling, i genuinely have concerns about a litany of issues surrounding ai such as the environmental cost, the double standard of corporate theft being okay and piracy being a serious crime, the ways the ai corporation ceos want to use ai vs how any technology should benefit the populace. i have a viewpoint, not an agenda. i also think and post about a wide variety of other topics. that said, if an ai community wants to block me, that’s fine, i was probably going to block them too. not because i think they’re wrong to have their community, but because i have zero interest in engaging there. it’s like how i block all communities in languages i don’t speak. it’s not an act of me censoring or hating them. it’s just me cleaning up my feed because it doesn’t make sense to be there
i have a viewpoint, not an agenda.
But on Lemmy, that’s a rare thing. Most have an agenda.
I work in IT and think AI is the second biggest threat to the planet in the next 10 years.
100% guarantee that LLMs have already been instantiated on murderbot hardware
You don’t need to speculate or go “I guarantee”.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AI-assisted_targeting_in_the_Gaza_Strip
samesies. it’s grifters leading the blind in that field and it’s already had devastating effects in certain areas
They shouldn’t be. I’ve messaged the two mods and asked them to respond, because I don’t know the details.
We found the answer (kinda)! It was @Draconic_NEO@lemmy.dbzer0.com See here: https://discuss.tchncs.de/post/34853477
I was called out by name for a single downvote and culled from a score of Communities I did not participate in by them.
“Create more slop” is, in fact, a message I disagree with rather strongly and did downvote that (and only that) post. I PM’d the the mod in response to that post:
Brigading is organized. I, a single person, downvoted one post I saw in /All because it is actively content with a message I do not care for or agree with. Bad form would be going through everything in the community and downvoting. I didn’t do that either. What I had done is called “using the platform as intended.” And you overreacted with a ban.
So we’ve effectively solved the first part, but not the three Stable Diffusion parts… Those also seem to line up with another single downvote a month later. Again, hardly brigading or vote manipulation.
EDIT: Huh. Looks like we had someone in this thread downvoting nearly every post in here.
EDIT: Huh. Looks like we had someone in this thread downvoting nearly every post in here.
if it is draconic who’s downvoting that would be a hilarious lack of self reflection. Is there any way to check?
Mods or Admin can. I can’t.
I’m still trying to get my head around people giving votes that much attention. Maybe Lemmy has started getting refugees from other places that live and die by the arrows.
Someone go in there and do the same thing and see what happens. I would but you’ve probably picked up on my apathy by this point.
The mods that banned me for ‘systemic down voting’ and ‘anti-ai harassment’ because I down voted a few AI posts and didn’t feel bad also lectured me about how horrible down voting is and how much it hurts the fediverse.
My upvote to down vote ratio is far better than either of those two mods.
I’ve seen quite a few people banned for downvotes in comms. It always makes me wonder what they think lurkers do.
They assume anyone who down votes without commenting is brigading.
Oh i know that. I’m saying it’s crazy because it just bans more lurkers than anyone. We’re probably on the same page.
Yeah, the mods who are doing this appear to believe lurkers don’t exist and anyone who doesn’t make a comment but down votes is part of a brigade.
I just said to another here in this thread: Downvotes hurt visibility. Downvote trolls can be a problem for small communities trying to build up. I managed to discover the serial downvoters on my old lemm.ee comm and when I banned them (about 4 of them?) it had a huge impact. They didn’t all downvote /everything/ but they downvoted a lot of things, and no contribution. And if they got in early, they could sink new threads. Now, I wouldn’t just downvote randoms for occasional downvotes - but if I kept seeing the same names on threads (and they never actually engaged with the community) with no discernable patterns - I might.
Made a huge difference.
that happens on reddit to, but with reporting. if you report when someone dint respond or you dint respond to them, the mods get mad enough to ban you, or if they feel like even if the report was report-worthy, the mods might not think so.
Because votes = views.
If you make something and it instantly gets to -2 within seconds because of bot/trolls it means no one will ever see it.
Well luckily it was just AI slop and they didn’t actually make anything.
Creativity is in the idea.
Drawing is dexterity not creativity.
What is important is that what they made reflected what they wanted to, not that they used a pencil or a stylus.
Preach, brother!
Disagree. Creativity is in the idea, the composition, and the execution.
A prompter hardly even has the idea in the first place.On top of that: “drawing” is labor.
Tell that to Andy Warhol.
Well luckily it was just AI slop and they didn’t actually make anything.
Meh, I actually have a very successful side business selling things with AI slop all over them. So there is something I make with AI: money. I make more money from that than my retirement check. I steal from the lying capitalist megacorps. lol
every time i learn something new about you it’s so on-brand
Right?! Thanks, friend! :)
That’s embarrassing. I’m surprised you would admit that even in pseudonymity.
Embarrassing for you, maybe. Obviously, not embarrassing for me.
I’m just riding the wave while it lasts. I don’t treat it like a real job. More like skimming cream off the top while the corrupt capitalist system lumbers along. I know the window for making money this way is probably short, but that just makes it sweeter.
The megacorps are raking in billions, and I get to sneak in, steal the product that they’ve already stolen, and laugh all the way to my tiny bank. They build the machines, pump out the slop, and flood the world with it. I just show up with a spoon.
Picture a giant bull in a field, stuffing its face. Flies swarm around it, laying eggs in the shit. And I’m a little scruffy bird perched on its back, snacking on the flies and soaking up the ride. The bull does all the work. I just feast on the ecosystem it creates.
I grow fat off the slop that megacorp capitalists overproduce. I use them, instead of them using me. That’s the game, friend. Delicious.
You’re fighting a fight you can’t win. AI isn’t going anywhere. I’m just adapting to the situation. And laughing.
That’s very capitalist of you
I’m using their own methods against them. No regrets.
reddit monitors upvotes/downvotes heavily, maybe they are coming from reddit, in addition reddit are using other nebelous reasons to ban people in a sub.
Not related to the OP here, but downvote trolls can be a problem for small communities trying to build up. I managed to discover the serial downvoters on my old lemm.ee comm and when I banned them (about 4 of them?) it had a huge impact. They didn’t all downvote /everything/ but they downvoted a lot of things, and no contribution. And if they got in early, they could sink new threads. Now, I wouldn’t just ban randoms for occasional downvotes - but if I kept seeing the same names on threads (and they never actually engaged with the community) with no discernable patterns - I might.
Made a huge difference.
Thank you for limiting your bans to people who were actual serial down voters and not just someone who happened to down vote a single post.
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Fair enough. I tend to block before down voting and that’s rare. Haven’t thought of how much votes actually matter, but obviously it does on the smaller scale.
I should also add that 2 or the accounts I banned literally had no post or comment history despite being active for years. Their only purpose was to downvote.
I don’t have an issue with this instance being pro-AI, but I find it weird as fuck how harshly skeptics are treated
To clarify, we [admins] didn’t do this. It was a mod of the community that moderated lots of other communities that decided to ban them from everything
PTB, banning people from unrelated communities is very much overstepping
It’s been a common thing for awhile now, unfortunately. My .ee account was randomly banned from a bunch of comms because of being pro-ai or somesuch ridiculous thing.
It’s also common practice on .blahaj
It’s not a “common practice on blahaj”. It’s just how lemmy does instance bans.
I generally don’t community ban people, I tend to instance ban them, because if they’re breaking community rules, but not instance rules, it’s up the community mods to deal with, and if they’re breaking instance rules, they get an instance ban.
And when you instance ban someone, and choose to remove their content, that’s what it looks like in a modlog. It’s not because I’ve gone and selected a whole bunch of community bans. It’s just how lemmy works
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Blahaj is specifically a safe environment for LGBTQ+ folks who usually face harassment elsewhere, pre-existing homophobia or transphobia is a totally valid reason to be banned pre-emptively in my opinion. The safe environment doesn’t exist if you just let anyone in and then ban them after they cause trouble.
(Using “you” in general here, not to mean you specifically, OP) if you’re hanging around outside a gay bar talking about how cool your schutzstaffel tattoo is, they aren’t going to let you inside the doors. Same idea here.
.blahaj admins/mods will ban you from every space they control for any reason they don’t like you. They will then just say that person was a bigot to try to avoid drama.
They do not have consistent moderation policies, and use their small amount of power maliciously.
They try to curate a group of people who will not question them and will tribalisticly defend the space no matter what.
.blahaj admins/mods will ban you from every space they control
I don’t moderate any communities outside of blahaj.
And that group of people seem quite pleased with Ada’s strategy, she’s one of the most well loved moderators I’ve ever seen in any community.
If you don’t like it, that’s fine. The space isn’t for you.
I wouldn’t expect a community of handpicked loyalists to be unhappy with their idol.
If you don’t like it, that’s fine. The space isn’t for you.
This is the exact type of passive agressive tribalism she curates. Thanks for being the example i guess.
I agree I don’t feel safe there, it’s better for me to not contribute to that space and let it go the way of the lgbtq subs on reddit with their idol mods who could do no wrong.
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Literally never said that.
I’m also trans.
Also I’m a progressive lmao.
Finally someone that speaks out
the amount of gaslighting they do is enormous
I find it weird how harsh AI haters treat people who use it.
well how are you supposed to treat people who roll coal?
Like you’re doing right now?
Did you not know that data centres use a huge amount of electricity, or did you think your posting was environmentally free?
Have you ever gone on a vacation? Because if so you’ve polluted more from one trip than all my years of AI art.
On an individual level generating an image is barely more any more resource intensive than a Google search. So don’t try to pull that shit when you’re just as guilty as using computers, the internet, and electricity for your personal enjoyment.
Depends on the usage:
- Generating images of witches - Not very harsh.
- Perpetrating genocide - Very harsh.
Could the same not be said of computers in general?
Yes, and how well do people treat Mark Zuckerbot?
He’s an android. Android is a phones not computers duh.
People are assholes to people who disagree with them, no matter the topic.
You can find examples of people on each ‘side’ being assholes. Social media teaches people to be outraged, not to have any empathy.
You can find examples of people on each ‘side’ being assholes
Very true!
As a Mac guy since the 90s, I can tell the hate and bile against AI is on another level, though. Relatively speaking.
I also recognize that the environmental and societal impacts of AI are why it’s so different from your typical fanboy/platform/lifestyle argument.
Like, that guy commenting about AI here does not really deserve the -4 votes his comment had when I started writing this.
I also think r/singularity types are off the deep end too. The way they are frothing at the mouth for societal collapse/UBI/etc is wild.
A lot of peope consider it immoral.
Those same people probably find intellectual property moral, so immoral people themselves.
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Thats a capitalism problem, not an AI problem. AI is just the most recent example.
They shouldn’t have to rely on maybe getting paid so they can have food, shelter, and other basic things for living.
Right… but they do… so…
Irrelevant until we fix that problem. And guess what? Advocating for AI in the meantime is only going to give more power to corporations :) so great job, bud!
I dont advocate for corporate AI.
I’d also mention most users on db0 are far more likely to be using fully open models and models they’ve trained themselves (which is what I do, mostly log/error eval stuff).
That said, “fixing” AI will solve nothing, because capitalism is going to find yet another way to screw them over. Banning AI tomorrow isn’t going to provide job security or a stable income, it wasn’t before and it isn’t now.
I work with a lot of creatives, and so many are contract based and struggle between them. Several of them have been finding work cleaning up (as in, creating new) materials that were AI generated and look terrible.
So again, the issue is capitalism, and AI is just the most recent conversation piece. AI isn’t the root of the problem, nor is the problem “solved” without it.
This just in: Technology makes some jobs obsolete. More at 11.
Right, did you miss the part where the AIs are usually trained using stolen data and also consume huge amounts of energy? Why are you defending AI rn? 🥱
Did I miss the part where you made a terrible argument and are now pivoting to something else?
Nope sure didn’t.
Congratulations you’ve discovered capitalism is the enemy.
No reasonable leftist will ever take you seriously if you want to fight for the status quo.
So go fuck yourself :)
Yes, capitalism IS bad. Labor is stolen and exploited for profit by people who added nothing or next to nothing. Sound familiar?
No, you absolute child, it is LAUGHABLE for you to consider yourself a “leftist”.
Real leftists advocate for harm reduction, meaning that defending individual creator’s IP rights are a MUST, at least until capitalism is abolished.
In other words… got anything intelligent to say, or just going to keep saying stupid shit?
Liberals advocate for harm reduction. Leftists advocate for revolution.
I find it weird as fuck how harshly skeptics are treated
It’s reactionary, they’ll get trolled to hell otherwise.
I moderate a community on Reddit which allowed AI posts. Until recently, the community got less than one AI post per month. Regardless, every post would get an onslaught of hateful comments and false reports full of curses.
Recently, the subreddit got a few more AI images than usual. Less than a third of the posts over the last month before I personally removed multiple of them for quality reasons. The accepted consensus between commenters, however, was the opposite of this reality.
Not to say the actions of this mod were correct, in fact it seems ridiculous. This is just to answer why they would be harsh.
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