The homeowner told police the two men said they were police and claimed they were at the home to serve a warrant.
[The homeowner] became suspicious, because, you know, they have a ring camera too, and the suspects were saying they had a warrant, but it was just two people and they’re masked up and no police cars, no lights or anything like that," said Lt. Khan with HPD.
At some point, police said the men shot at the homeowner through the door, prompting the homeowner to return fire.
The homeowner was not hurt in the gunfire, but the two men were both hit and pronounced dead at the scene.
lots of us said that this would be exactly what would be happening with masked police using constant escalation dominance as a tactic.
this is civil war behavior from a civilization.
it will also lead to blood feuds between people and the police as a whole. i expect to see more actual police police getting ambushed even if they are in a sanctuary city and are not acting to aid ICE.
expect to see more actual police police getting ambushed even if they are in a sanctuary city and are not acting to aid ICE.
Unless the cops start shooting ICE on sight for the safety of their neighborhood, they are complicit and get what they deserve.
lots of us said that this would be exactly what would be happening
And this is also what they wanted, they WANT people to start firing on cops in masks, this is the escalation they need to make the excuse for turning the US into a massive locked-down corporate prison.
“What’s that? People are shooting at our precious law enforcement heroes?? Let loose the Palantir Drones! FLY MY PRETTIES!”
They don’t need the excuse, just look at D.C. in the past week. And escalation will only make things worse for them. They’re looking at an armed insurgency situation akin to the “War on Terror,” which proved that an entrenched group amongst the populace is impossible to oust because anybody could be an insurgent, and taking one out will create more people willing to take revenge. There used to be an excellent Flash game about this very point where you shot cruise missiles at terrorists walking across the screen. And every time that a missile would explode, it would inevitably hit civilians in the area, and those nearby would turn into more terrorists. You’d just continue to fill the screen with more and more terrorists than there were originally until eventually you gave up.
Somebody a few weeks ago said in a thread on a similar subject that the military’s conclusion was that you need about 3 soldiers for every insurgent in a population. There’s no way that they can draft as much as theoretically 75% of the population.
It’s a whole lot of bluster, and if we could get organized we could topple the whole thing. ICE has homes they go back to at the end of the day. They don’t have army bases to hide in.
That flash game sounds like political art. Just WOW. As an aspiring game dev that’s just a brilliant way of getting the point across that I could only dream of.
The trouble with a lot of these things, sadly, is getting it in front of people who need to get the message rather than those who already agree with it from the start.
And their families, sadly.
ACAB. Shoot fascists in masks in their masks. Full stop.
Where is this thin blue line they talk about? Ain’t protecting anyone from shit.
Hey man, nice shot.
Nice shot, man.
Man shot nice.
Good for the homeowner. Any “law enforcement officer” who hide their faces and wont show ID are probably acting criminally and they should not be tolerated by society.
KHOU 11’s Michelle Choi spoke with a neighbor, who said they heard a total of 22 gunshots.
The homeowner was not hurt in the gunfire, but the two men were both hit and pronounced dead at the scene.
I…who can count that many gunshots?
Do you not?
Well, if you have a Ring camera, you could playback the video.
Possible. If that’s the source, then the reporter didn’t report it correctly.
Texans
You sure? There’s conflicting eyewitnesses accounts of how many shots were fired at JFK. The Warren Commission settled on three, and whatever it actually was, it couldn’t have been that much more.
Nobody said they were good at counting.
Honestly, you start counting as soon as you hear the first one. Glock is what, 14+1? Big .357 only holds 6, some 38 special revolvers hold 7. Counting can save your life.
Depends on which Glock, whether it’s fitted with an extended mag or not. Count all you want, if the other person is using a semi auto pistol, you can’t know how many rounds they have loaded, and changing to a fresh magazine takes almost no time.
Well, don’t count then. IDGAF
Glock has a bunch of different models with varying capacities. And some companies make extended magazines that hold up to 40 rounds. And that’s just Glock.
Counting is not possible in real life.
The Glock 43 carries a 6 or 7 round mag standard, you can buy 12 round mags and 50 round drums.
I mean, I count all sorts of shit and gunfire is one of those things.
So what you’re saying is… he did think they were cops.
HPD Detective Kyle Stringer told Choi… that real officers do not wear ski masks.
🤔
Detective Stringer doesn’t watch the news.
Detective Stringer makes a well calculated statement about his stance on ICE.
Sounds like he could be having an awakening.
Hope his brothers don’t turn on him.
iirc there has been precedent set for stand your ground laws even if they where police, if they did not reasonably defend yourself. If they dont provide a warrant, stand your ground.
Can we Gofundme him a new door?
Afroman might cover it
Do the door frame, lock, and hinges too. Just in case.
So. Were they cops or not?
Not.
Dang.
Unclear. ICE lies constantly.
Is anyone else finding this story a little strange? Not someone finally shooting fake-ICE people. But:
Fake-ICE is wearing bulletproof vests and shoots at the homeowner through the door. The homeowner isn’t injured. Fine.
The homeowner returns fire, through the door, hits and kills the two guys wearing bulletproof vests. Doesn’t that strike anyone else as odd? Both dead, neither injured, despite bulletproof vests, despite being shot through a door?
I mean you got to remember a bulletproof vest is still you know, a vest. Plenty of places you can killed that aren’t on your chest.
Homeowner probably has a peep hole, in addition to the ring camera giving him locational knowledge of where the purps were outside the door. They could only guess where he was.
There’s different types of vest, and they’re rated to stop different types of bullet.
If these guys are just pretending to be cops, they may well have just grabbed the cheapest vests they could find that looked convincing.
And a rifle round could have just punched straight on through a vest only rated for pistol rounds.
Also most vests don’t cover the neck or sides of the body. Or the big arteries in the legs.
Also the vests could have been fake.
Honestly, if their goal was to imitate the appearance of cops, that seems likely. I imagine full kevlar is pretty expensive.
It depends. If you’re buying brand new, brand name stuff, then yeah, it can be pricey. But if you’re milsurp stuff, then it is not as expensive… but be warned, Kevlar absolutely degrades over time and a vest that is 6 or 9 years old may not be able to stop the same bullets it would have been able to when it was factory fresh or just a few years old.
BTW, you can buy ballistic armor that looks exactly like normal clothes, but those are expensive as all fucking hell. This hoodie can stop up to a .44 magnum, but it will set you back by more than 700$ (I am thinking of taxes + shipping costs on top of the actual hoodie).
My take is that it is very likely that they were prop vests, meaning they were just simple clothing and will do nothing to stop a bullet.
I think you can get a III-a vest for about $500. That’s not terribly expensive, but a criminal planning something like this may have been a little rushed and strapped for cash. It’s been a few years since I cared to even look, so prices may have gotten higher.
You can get a IIIA vest from a Chinese factory for about $50. If you’re worried about the quality, just buy two and shoot one!
Doesnt seem odd at all. Maybe he had a rifle or a combat shotgun and they had pistols. Or maybe he found cover and they didnt.
Texas gun law requires going through a bit more effort to legally buy handguns instead of long guns, so this is very plausible.
How many vests cover the face? You can also shrapnel their groin area, and they bleed out before any ambulance will be there.
There’s also the option where the vest stops it but you have a crushed sternum
Also if you’re using magnum slugs then God help you…
One of the reasons why I picked a shotgun and use 000 buckshot is because of the spread. I assume my aim sucks, and hope that hitting the bad guys in a unarmored limb will be enough to remove them from a fight.
Look, I wanna scare the fucker off, not redo drywall.
Hay, I’ve only been here 20 years, what do I know?
Any recommendations?
If you talking shotguns, I am an amateur, so use a hefty block of salt: I have a VR80. It is a semi-auto that uses magazines, which should make it better for military situations. My guess is that if civil war breaks out, both sides will initially be recruiting troops with whatever kit they happen to have - formal outfitting by Blue States would depend on where and when you are, so it would be better to bring a gun that is fit for combat in the first place. If you live in California or other restrictive states, you remove a pin and split the gun in half, allowing the mag release to operate. Apparently a small piece of the tool can be removed to permanently enable the mag button.
The VR80 will take a good number of rounds fired before it starts to loosen up. Jamming is an issue during the break-in, but that is fine if you are practicing. This weapon in particular prefers more powerful rounds, and is designed to be ambidextrous, along with being AR-15 style for addons. If you can, ditch the stock - it doesn’t telescope, and feels awkward to me.
I cannot agree with your point about the break in period enough. Thats a pain point for all semi auto shotguns. You’re gonna need to expect to drop some cash on rounds (Ideally 1400+ FPS) to get it reliable. But on the bright side, youll have plenty of experience clearing stove pipes by the time its broke in so in the event of a jam youll clear it quick
It’s alright, it’s also kind of a waste, unless you’re like clearing a small area or slinging slugs at something heavily armored you could really get everything accomplished with a traditional tube shotgun, if that doesn’t work get a keltec, as far as military situations get a semi rifle or honestly even a bolt unless for some reason you’re trying to kill everything 30yds in front of you multiple times.
Incoming drones are one of my worries. If anything calls for emptying a clip, it would be that situation.
They have their place. I have one for home defense. A shotgun requires less precision than a handgun and my wife does not devote a ton of time at the range. We also have children so she’s understandly apprehensive around keeping a weapon loaded. So if you have to load the bitch when you need it, slapping that 10 round mag in is gonna be a lot easier for someone like her than trying to manually tubefeed the rounds.
Then have it loaded and not chambered, it’ll be much harder to load those mags then slide a shell in a regular shotgun, cause you know I also own one.
I have a VR82 for 3 gun, tons of fun with it. Took about 300 rounds for mine to break in with no more stove pipes or FTF.
Yeah, practice at the range until your aim doesn’t suck.
I’m staunchly antigun… most of the time. In this case, with Dumpy mcdementiapants leading the way, arm the fuck up. I have no recommendations. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
The other good thing about shotguns: Low penetration. If there’s a victim visible behind your attacker, you’re likely to hit them with any kind of projectile. But, if there’s a victim behind a wall or in a house behind your attacker, at least a shotgun will stop at the drywall.
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200% damage multiplier.
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Who said it was a solid door? Could be a screen door or a door with a window pane.
Occam’s razor the problem instead of looking for a conspiratorial or nefarious solution when there’s no reason to.
Vests cover vital organs, but there’s a lot of other places you can be shot and killed.
Bulletproof vests are also only rated for certain calibers too, mostly of what you’d think of as a bulletproof vest will only stop pistol calibers. Sure, you can get stuff that’ll stop rifle shots, but then you’re looking at wearing multiple 5-10 lb metal plates and spending quite a bit of money to get them.
And they’ll only stop a number of rifle shots, typically intermediate caliber. Once you’re dealing with an opposing force using .338 lapua, you might be better off adopting the gecko45 school of duct taping plates together and using your spouse as a human shield as you make your way to your fighting weapon.
Oh god, I never think about that guy until he’s brought up, and then it’s a hilarious morning read to go through all the insanity again.
A bulletproof vest reduces harm, not negate it. Also, vests come in a variety of grades. As can one expect, the heavier and more expensive ones offer more protection, but those can still fail. Vests, like most insurance, only offers so much coverage from disaster.
Not really. A bulletproof vest won’t protect your head. Meanwhile they’re standing directly on the other side of a door that they’re shooting through, while the home owner could have been anywhere on the other side of the door. They’re playing a guessing game, but the homeowner can just shoot the door at head-height and their bulletproof vests will mean nothing.
The neighbors heard 22 shots. Most of that could have been a pray-and-spray tactic by the homeowner.
I love happy endings.
Schrödinger’s cop. Every masked creep with a power complex is simultaneously a dangerous criminal you should shoot on sight for your own protection and a police officer with qualified immunity. The waveform collapses when you get tried for murder, if you win it was a criminal all along, but if you get the electric chair it was a cop.
Just means more aggressive actions by cops to preemptively subdue any resistance. You’ll get a flashbang and tear gas launched into your backseat, dragged out and cuffed at a traffic stop.
Thankfully, tear gas could be bought on Temu
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Wave function.
That thingy
In Canada, they’d probably arrest the home owner and have the courts sort it out. No joke.
do you have any past news stories that approach this type of response from the Canadian government ?
Yeah, I do.
A home-owner was recently attacked by an armed man (who had broken into several homes before, he had a record of doing so, and had been arrested multiple times already) and was arrested and charged because he himself was armed: https://globalnews.ca/news/11345655/ontario-man-charged-with-assaulting-home-intruder-acted-within-his-rights-lawyer/
The crown prosecutor has not dropped charges so far.
That’s honestly fine. If someone ends up dead, especially if the killer is the only surviving witness, it’s pretty reasonable to have a thorough determination of responsibility and legality.
Criminal charges are not necessary for that and this line of thinking is insane. The victim of a home invasion must now necessarily be charged and re-victimized by the justice system? This practice won’t last.
No one said they should be charged, but they need to be investigated to determine that it was actually a home invasion.
Do you think an investigation could occur on scene, where you have a ring camera, dead individuals who might be able to be identified as not cops, their car, the evidence on the house’s door of bullet holes, etc. and show that the homeowner maybe was justified? Maybe?
Yep, but going through those motions is enough to ruin someone’s life because of ruining their employment prospects because of their name being associated with horrific crimes, even if they are entirely innocent.
Arresting someone because a crime may have occurred, without there being evidence to determine such, is not great, especially when there’s video proof that it was self defense. It’d now be up to a jury putting the home owner under a microscope to determine if the homeowner made the correct split-second decisions in a situation so stressful they can’t even imagine what it’s like because they never lived through it.
Canada has jury trials don’t they? Arrest is means suspicion, doesn’t mean a conviction will happen especially with a sympathetic jury. On the other hand, the US’s rule of law has kinda been falling apart. They could get murdered while in pre-trial detention.
Yep, but going through those motions is enough to ruin someone’s life because of ruining their employment prospects because of their name being associated with horrific crimes, even if they are entirely innocent.
Arresting someone because a crime may have occurred, without there being evidence to determine such, is not great, especially when there’s video proof that it was self defense. It’d now be up to a jury putting the home owner under a microscope to determine if the homeowner made the correct split-second decisions in a situation so stressful they can’t even imagine what it’s like because they never lived through it.
Exactly, I defended myself against a bully in school and the fucking school admin called the police on me. Fuck everyone involved with that school admin. ACAB.
I was like 17, I was not born in this country.
I was so lucky that my mother naturalized as a US Citizen (edit: because Child Citizenship Act automatically made me a Citizen so I don’t have to do Naturalization myself), because imagine having to explain to the USCIS Natualization officer about the arrest record. Because they ask about all arrests, as in: any that ever happened, including those that did not result in convictions, or even crimes that were sealed expunged, or pardoned. They can see those records so lying is pointless (and they could retroactively revoke any immigration benefits obtained when they find out in the future).
“Innocent until proven guilty” yea right, totally. If you are white and citizen at birth, maybe, cuz otherwise they can fuck over your life, tell you to go to a country you’ve never been in for a decade.
Fuck CCP for ruining my birth country. Fuck USCIS, fuck ICE, fuck conservatives. So many adversaries I have to deal with in this fucked up universe.
Yep, I defended myself against an intellectually disabled bully who bit me randomly, the teachers high fived him, and I got suspended for the day. I was super young at the time, but I still remember it vividly, and now that I’m older I’m lucky that it wasn’t worse and that they didn’t try calling the police on me at the time even though I was only defending myself but it was still a fucked up situation regardless.
Arrest is means suspicion
Arrest means the arresting officer has probable cause to believe that a crime occurred. In this case, with two individuals dead outside of a house’s entry, the door having bullet holes that have markings consistent with bullets traveling in directions into the house and out of it, and the ring camera evidence, I’d say it would be ridiculous to have any belief that the homeowner committed a crime.
The homeowner likely gets off scott free but in Canada we still have to go through the legal motions. The cop on the scene does not have the right to let the homeowner off, the courts do.
Yep, but going through those motions is enough to ruin someone’s life because of ruining their employment prospects because of their name being associated with horrific crimes, even if they are entirely innocent.
Arresting someone because a crime may have occurred, without there being evidence to determine such, is not great, especially when there’s video proof that it was self defense. It’d now be up to a jury putting the home owner under a microscope to determine if the homeowner made the correct split-second decisions in a situation so stressful they can’t even imagine what it’s like because they never lived through it.
I agree that guilt by association may cause problems for the victim but the most reasonable way to proceed is to gather facts and evidence and make decisions based upon that information. I believe that this process is the most effective, even if there is absolute proof that the victim is innocent (assume there was a live stream of the incident for all to see and everyone who saw it was shown that the victim was innocent). We should still jump the hoops and fill out the forms.
I just don’t agree, I don’t see how victimizing someone twice when there’s absolute proof they are innocent is in any way productive or a good thing for society. It’s really shitty and can ruin someones life when they’ve already been through a traumatic event. It’s bordering on being downright evil tbh.
I’m curious how idiotic your cops are there… Do they get to arrest folks just because a crime might have occurred, or do they need evidence of it? Because a ring camera video, AND bullet holes in the door with tell tale markings of traveling inward, towards the homeowner, plus outward, AND the car on the street, AND the masked individuals that are now easily identified as NOT COPS all screams to me that no crime was committed.
Some cops are idiots, most aren’t. About the same everywhere I guess.
Yes, they would likely arrest them anyway because a death (or multiple deaths) took place and let the crown prosecutor and then juries handle it.
Fuck home invaders. Glad the homeowner had the tools to defend himself!
ICE wear masks, and no-knock warrants are a thing.
Kudos to the home owner for being vigilant and shooting BACK once they opened fire
And they should be shot while doing so.
