• Endmaker@ani.socialEnglish
    131·
    25 days ago

    Same thing with Fediverse instances.

    IMO the linux and/or fediverse community could learn a thing or two about UX from the establishment.

    I believe the best approach is to take note of the Pareto Principle: 20% of instances / distros would meet the need of 80% of users.

    I would simply recommend Ubuntu / lemmy.world to complete beginners (just based on market share). If they are interested in alternatives, they would naturally seek those out themselves.

    This concept is nothing new e.g. Google presents their searchbar front and centre; power users would click on “Advance Search” for their needs.

    • ch00f@lemmy.world
      7·
      25 days ago

      I started mainlining Linux about a year and a half ago after playing with it for a bit in 2007-ish and running a headless server for a decade or so.

      I just installed Ubuntu because that was what Framework officially supported. I can’t think of what a newbie user would find lacking with Ubuntu. It does about everything that Windows does fine. I’ve heard similar things about Mint. Why do we have to over-complicate things for new users? Just shove them towards a distro and let them know they can probably fix whatever they don’t like with a reinstall later.

    • DaTingGoBrrr@lemmy.world
      51·
      25 days ago

      If someone were to recommend me a distro with the GNOME desktop environment then I would not be a Linux for long. GNOME is weird and confusing. I am convinced that KDE Plasma, Cinnamon, LXDE and other more Windows-like desktops is better for a new Linux user. If they want an alternative desktop environment they can seek it out themselves.

      • Endmaker@ani.socialEnglish
        2·
        25 days ago

        a distro with the GNOME desktop environment

        We would have lost a newbie by this point.

        I don’t think we are representative of the average user. For example, noone from my family heard of these terms, or even care. They just want to browse the web, watch some Youtube videos, and that’s it.

        • DaTingGoBrrr@lemmy.world
          31·
          25 days ago

          That why they shouldn’t be recommended anything that has to do with GNOME. Just give them anything that closely resembles Windows.

          I installed Linux Mint on my mom’s old laptop and on my stepmother’s aunt’s laptop as well. I have had 0 support calls since then! As you say, all they want to do is browse the web.

      • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
        8·
        25 days ago

        There are a few gaps. Seems it’s not being as diligently updated as once was.

        There are even some old distros I failed to find on it.

        … Didn’t there used to be a text-searchable svg version of it?

        • tyler@programming.dev
          2·
          25 days ago

          Idk. I was making a joke though. A history of Linux chart is functionally useless for actually choosing a distro.

          • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
            2·
            25 days ago

            A history of Linux chart is functionally useless for actually choosing a distro.

            I’ve used that many times to help me go distro surfing. Very handy for discovery.

            • tyler@programming.dev
              1·
              24 days ago

              For a new person it’s useless. For anyone distro surfing why wouldn’t you just use distro Watch?

              • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
                1·
                24 days ago

                For a new person it’s useless. For anyone distro surfing why wouldn’t you just use distro Watch?

                I disagree. Not useless. Shows the lineage of distros. Facilitates broader awareness. Handy education. Very well accompanies the likes of distrowatch, at a long glance showing the forest past being lost in the trees and slowly trying to work it out. Expedites the new (or soon to be) user to better know their way around, and perhaps help them go towards whichever branch they prefer or away from any they garner a dislike for, saving time. See past the whataboutism false-dichotomy? Why not both?

                • tyler@programming.dev
                  1·
                  24 days ago

                  Huh? A new user is going to have trouble understanding the base difference between gnome and kde. Flooding them with information about the history of all these operating systems will do nothing except to scare them off even more.

      • tal@lemmy.todayEnglish
        1·
        25 days ago

        If you know how to edit a comma-separated-value text file and how to submit a PR on GitHub, you could make the image larger.

        • tyler@programming.dev
          11·
          25 days ago

          I just have to assume you’re a troll at this point. That graphic is not helpful at all to anyone except those that care about the history of Linux. For everyone else it’s useless. I was making a joke about how one of the distros I use isn’t on there. I don’t know the history of my distro and honestly do not care. Any noob also would not care.

  • bunchberry@lemmy.world
    192·
    25 days ago

    I tried to encourage fellow Linux users to just encourage one distro. It doesn’t have to be a good distro, but just one the person is least likely to run into issues with and if they do, the most likely to be able to find solutions easily for their issues. Things like Ubuntu and Mint clearly fit the bill. They can then decide later if they want to change to a different one based on what they learn from using that one.

    No one listened to me, because everyone wants to recommend their personal favorite distro rather than what would lead to the least problems for the user and would be the easiest to use. A person who loves PopOS will insist the person must use PopOS. A person who loves Manjaro will insist that the person must use Manjaro. Linux users like so many different distros that this just means everyone recommends something different and just make it confusing.

    I gave up even bothering after awhile. Linux will never be big on desktop unless some corporation pushes a Linux-based desktop OS.

    • GreenShimada@lemmy.world
      8·
      25 days ago

      People need to put their egos aside and recommend a distro suited to a soft landing for a new person. That includes knowing that person’s technical skill and who around them will help when real issues pop up that require hand-holding and not just “Well, there’s a forum and you ask there.”

      IMO that’s Mint, but I also haven’t found a distro that has tempted me away from Mint, either.

    • cRazi_man@europe.pub
      13·
      25 days ago

      Linux will never be big on desktop unless some corporation pushes a Linux-based desktop OS.

      And of all possible companies, Valve is the one that’s made the most progress with this.

      • Doomsider@lemmy.world
        1·
        25 days ago

        96%+ people access the web through mobile. Desktops are out, they were over a decade ago. The kernels that are running mobile devices are either Linux or XNU.

        Non-windows OS already took over computing. Who really cares that the majority of business installs are windows. The people that matter on the desktop are all already using Linux.

  • Snapz@lemmy.world
    9010·
    25 days ago

    OP is posting AI slop and plagiarizing other people’s work. Lead image seems a cyanide and happiness cartoon, but it’s a blatent ripoff, and they watermarked it with their own username to boot. And no communication out transparency around any of that as well

  • squaresinger@lemmy.world
    38·
    25 days ago

    Choice is good when you can make an informed choice. Choice is bad if you are forced to make a decisions where you have no idea of the consequences.

  • texture@lemmy.world
    261·
    25 days ago

    see heres the problem, youre doing that in the wrong order.

    first figure out your DE/WM preference, THEN choose a package manager with the repos that will best support that for your use case and update cycle preferences. (the distro)

  • FauxLiving@lemmy.world
    1381·
    25 days ago

    All you need to know is that, whatever you pick, you made the wrong choice and you will be roasted if you ever attempt to explain your decision.

    Unless you use Arch, then you have chosen correctly.

    • NostraDavid@programming.dev
      21·
      25 days ago

      You’re obviously not using NixOS. I clearly don’t even need to try to use such a subpar stateful system such as Arch, you absolute pleb.

      Am I out-jerking you already?

      I use NixOS, obviously.

    • MuckyWaffles@leminal.space
      1312·
      25 days ago

      Arch is utterly inferior because of its use of the Systemd “init” system, which is a bloated mess that completely disregards the Unix philosophy of doing one thing and doing it well, and shouldn’t be forgotten for its sins and heresy. “Arch Linux” (Really Arch Gnu/Linux, or more preferably Arch Gnu+Linux (Unless you consider that Gnu runs on top of Linux, in which case it’s Linux+Gnu)) cannot be taken seriously as a minimal do it yourself distro when it hinges on an software that has ties with RedHat, which has had a history of forcing their woke Wayland Display Server (Even though Xorg worked just fine, suspicious much?), as well as their DEI onto the entire Linux space - where politics shouldn’t play any role. A WOKE company like RedHat has no place in the open source community. If you want to be a true and righteous Linux user, I recommend Either Void Linux+Gnu (What manly men like myself use) or Gentoo.

      Edit: this is satire, I clearly interact with these people far too often to have done this good of a job.

      • FauxLiving@lemmy.world
        2·
        22 days ago

        Edit: this is satire, I clearly interact with these people far too often to have done this good of a job.

        Imagine if The Onion had to say this.

        Your target audience understood, the people downvoting probably are Ubuntu users anway.

      • 5C5C5C@programming.dev
        23·
        25 days ago

        It says something about how sad of a state the world is in when I can’t tell if this is satire or not.

          • MuckyWaffles@leminal.space
            1·
            25 days ago

            Lmao, I just made this account, yeah. It’s not my first Lemmy account. I made an account on lemmy.world back in 2023 I think (lost the account), and a PieFed account earlier this year, which I hardly used. I thought I could use a fresh start. (And sorry for the ambiguous satire)

            • DreamButt@lemmy.worldEnglish
              2·
              24 days ago

              I don’t think that’s on you. Like the person above said it’s more to do with how the world is rn

        • burntbacon@discuss.tchncs.de
          5·
          25 days ago

          I mean, it’s both good and bad. The amount of downvotes mean there is a large subset of folks who no longer recognize the twisting of stallman’s rant. They are new to linux, and not super-serious-no-casuals-allowed penguin lovers. It’s bad because I would love if everyone coming to linux could be as into it as I am. People who are invested into a thing take a much deeper look at things, and can appreciate it’s soft and jagged parts and then properly make recommendations on how to change things.

          • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
            21·
            25 days ago

            There has been I have noticed a marked increase in argumentum populum, argumentum ad lapidem and argumentum ad novitatem, with the influx of new users (in recent years), who seem to be coming to “Linux” like it’s another platform; another groupthink team to switch to [“PC vs Mac”], rather than Linux just being a kernel that has a license that qualifies it as having a Free Software philosophy, and the free software (free as in freedom) being the reason to use it.

            Like they’re still caught in, not just the fallacies and identity-attachment mass-formation malady, but also a consumerism and a dependence paradigm, rather than embracing the freedom to learn, to empower themselves and each other.

            It’s daunting to think, many may not know they can look deeper into it, not merely just use the software, but also study it, and change it, and share their changes… like they don’t know how we got here.

            Freedom forgotten is freedom lost.

      • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
        22·
        25 days ago

        Arch is utterly inferior because of its use of the Systemd “init” system, which is a bloated mess that completely disregards the Unix philosophy of doing one thing and doing it well, and shouldn’t be forgotten for its sins and heresy.

        So… do arch without systemd. (And not listed there, because its live-installer iso comes with systemd, is parabola linux, which does let you install with any of many init systems).

        Or as you say, any of many other distros that offer init-freedom.

        Though I’m not entirely sure if I’m replying to an instance of poe’s law, intended to mock those of us who see things largely like you depicted. n_n Which is fun.

        PS,

        history of forcing their woke Wayland Display Server (Even though Xorg worked just fine, suspicious much?),

        Yes. Actively inhibiting development of Xorg. The tighter they squeeze the more of us slip through their fingers. Now there’s XLibre (a Xorg fork, to continue (otherwise actively inhibited) patching and developing), and even Pheonix (a from-scratch implementation of the X11 protocol written in zig! ~ give it a couple years). Exciting times.

        Frankly I’m not even keen on the idea of pulse audio either. Funny how all this “Lennartware”'s so contemptable… from Lennart Poettering, who then went to work for Microsoft. Funny eh? Funny how it’s almost like it’s following the same ruthless dastardly insidious method of unscrupulously building a monopoly, via “embrace, extend, extinguish”. Not a fan of pulseaudio, systemd, and wayland. Much prefer free software stays closer to being in human reach, so more of us can make use of the 4 freedoms of free software. So it’s not just “free software” in name only, but in practice too.

        • MuckyWaffles@leminal.space
          2·
          25 days ago

          Sorry, my comment was satire, though I do daily drive Void Linux (and very much enjoy runit, and I’m looking to try openrc). Also I’m not really anti wayland, but I do dislike the squeezing of xorg development, as you mentioned. I’m pretty excited for the Phoenix project, as I’m a big fan of Zig myself, and I’m thinking of contributing. XLibre, I worry may be a lost cause with how many bridges I feel it’s maintainer has burned with so many people, but he’s also very committed so we’ll see.

  • 2910000@lemmy.world
    7·
    24 days ago

    For first-timers: pick at random and use it until it annoys you. Then you can make an informed decision second (third, fourth, …, nth) time around

  • mycodesucks@lemmy.world
    111·
    25 days ago

    Choose one at random from those with easy installation. Use it for a week. If you like it, stick with it. If it’s frustrating as heck, try another distro. Your skills picked up from the first one will very likely transfer over. As you narrow down your experience with what’s frustrating you, you can pinpoint what things you like and which you don’t and settle on the perfect distro for you.

    There is absolutely NO way to know that before you get your hands dirty and see what these options are and their quirks.

    • tal@lemmy.todayEnglish
      4·
      25 days ago

      “The first place to direct new users was to Linux From Scratch, so that they could determine whether they wanted to use a Linux distribution at all, or a more freeform approach.”

    • Honytawk@lemmy.zipEnglish
      4·
      25 days ago

      And that is the reason Linux will not go mainstream.

      No average user wants to spend time distro hopping, they want a functioning computer that can do anything they want. A configure and forget.

      So they will MUCH rather use Windows or Mac and be done with it than jump to hoops like you are proposing.

      • Digit@lemmy.wtfEnglish
        3·
        25 days ago

        I suspect there’s a circular definition of “average user” lurking there.

    • tal@lemmy.todayEnglish
      3·
      25 days ago

      Multiple partitions or single. LLVM-managed or not. Block-level encrypted partitions or not. Do you want your swap on a dedicated partition, as a swap file, and do you want it to be encrypted?

      If you decide that you want a multiple-partition installation and then let the installer do the partitioning, Debian’s installer still does a 100 MB /boot partition, which is woefully inadequate for present-day kernels as Debian packages them. 1 GB, maybe.