it’s almost as if almost every country in the world turning to fascism isn’t really that good for society.
Thats fucking depressing.
They’re too young to have been married, where their wife will disabuse them of this concept very quickly.
Thanks “social” media
Shocking. A generation that was told since childhood that gender roles are so important that they actually change your gender gives importance to gender roles. Absolutely no one could see it coming.
Are you confusing gender roles with gender expression again?
for lay people who aren’t educated in gender studies, there is no such difference.
the average person doesn’t even know what a gender role is dude. if i asked my 16 year old nephew about how he feels about ‘gender roles’ he’d look at me and go ‘what the fuck are you talking about?’
So which is it: has this topic been taught as super important since childhood, or does no-one know about it?
Also pretty sure a 4 year old would have little problem understanding “gender expression is how you act and dress and talk, gender roles are what people think you should act and dress and talk like”. So, IDK, maybe have your nephew checked or something?
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it is super important to rich liberal people, but not the rest of the world/usa. where i live i can’t walk down the street without gender war nonsense being all over the lamp posts, but that isn’t the case in most other places.
it’s also super important at universities who are full of ‘activists’.
If it’s not important to the rest of the USA then why can’t you walk down the street without seeing it? Could it be that it simply doesnt matter to you, and you’re projecting your own indifference onto the rest of society?
it’s important in my specific city. which is full of very wealthy very liberal people.
i’ve lived in many places and visit many places and other than Portland and a few other rich liberal areas, nobody cares.
It’s important to me, a trans person, that I’m allowed to take my medicine, use the bathroom that aligns with my gender, and be addressed with my chosen pronouns. But I don’t matter to you, I’m just a freak and the source of your problems.
You don’t matter to me because I don’t know you. You are not the source of any of my problems. You aren’t that important.
I don’t know where you live. Come to Boston. People will bend over backwards to give you a job because every company is desperate to prove how diverse their workforce is. Our governor is a lesbian and pro-queer. Of course, the big catch is, if you want to live here, you better be rich. We don’t want poor queer/trans people here, only wealthy ones! I have had quite a few trans/queer friends in my decade living here. But I have also known shitty trans people who I hate because they are whiny entitled people who treated me and other people horrible, including violence and rape. I have no clue if you are a good person or a shitty person, you could be either. Being trans doesn’t automatically make you special or good in my book though, it is meaningless to me. You probably also care a lot more about what’s between my legs than I do.
Sucks that other states hate trans people, but I don’t live there and I have no say in their government policies.
It doesn’t sound like people would bend over backwards to give me a job. I work in a factory and live in a trailer. They bend over backwards to give rich people jobs, and it has literally nothing to do with being queer. You’re getting mad about gender, but you should be mad about inequality.
Just as planned.
Stop existing at him!
People of both genders in Indonesia (66%) and Malaysia (60%) were most likely to agree with the statement, compared with 23% in the US and 13% in Great Britain.
How do you act surprised with this is beyond me.
people don’t understand that other cultures exist
Well, if they won’t become American, we have to kill them all. -MAGA
This is bait the guardian has been really shitty. I might just block them like fox news
Fucking scary. I’m afraid not only for young women, but for all of us who are of a certain age. As the Zoomers start getting elected to Congress, state legislature, judgeships, they’re going to think things like health care and human rights aren’t important.
Zoomers are the first gen that are statistically stupider at their age then the previous gen. And not exasperated by the fact that there no entry level jobs to maintain our develop their skills.
People of both genders in Indonesia (66%) and Malaysia (60%) were most likely to agree with the statement, compared with 23% in the US and 13% in Great Britain.
So I question how much of this actually takes into account massive cultural differences and how that can skew the results since this is apparently a global survey.
Zoomers most like boomers.
My parents are boomers and they’re not like that at all.
Even my grandfather wasn’t, although my grandmother’s sisters thought he was; it was my grandmother who insisted the kitchen was het domain, but apparently her much more feminist sisters (and this is a very Reformed protestant family) blamed him. Only after her death could he discover all the cool things he could cook.
The survey the article is based on is not of good quality (I’m being polite)… People without a proper degree in statistics should not be allowed to get anywhere near numbers… Here the [link] of the PDF: (https://www.kcl.ac.uk/assets/news/iwd-2026-global-charts-final.pdf)
I’m getting my doctorate in engineering statistics and I still would never go near numbers.
Wise 🙏
Looks like they’ve pulled the file. Good.
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Even with those numbers, it’s still frustrating.
You can see in the data that the country dominates attitude. Using only the global averages against the generational buckets isn’t very useful. I want to see the generational breakdown BY COUNTRY.
yes, but the global trend across countries is clear. economic stagnation, lower mobility, a lack of resources and opportunities available.
So people look back to the past and have nostalgia for it for the mid 20th century when those things were abundant, and along with it they look back at strict gender roles and the idea that men should work and women should be home makers.
It’s a fact that in societies with high wealth disparities and a lack of mobility gender and social roles tend to be more rigid, whereas in societies with more equality they are more flexible. Which is largely a product of people seeking economic security first and foremost, and gender freedom only after they have it.
It’s a fact that in societies with high wealth disparities and a lack of mobility gender and social roles tend to be more rigid, whereas in societies with more equality they are more flexible. Which is largely a product of people seeking economic security first and foremost, and gender freedom only after they have it.
You have any good sources on this? Not being cynical, just genuinely interested.
yeah I always assume articles that say X group is like Y thing is usually full of trump. these definately have to be taken with a grain of salt. Also boomers were the hippie generation. Theoretically they should be much larger on general equality.
“People without a proper degree in statistics should not be allowed to get anywhere near numbers” is my new favorite phrase. Thank you for the QC!
Yeah that checks out. My Gen z girlfriend has said as much. She’s into women and “men who are at least old enough to remember 9/11 clearly.”
The Gen Z men she has dated were “rude, cruel, and more interested in controlling me(her).”
If she was dating millennial men when millennials were in their 20s she’d probably complain about PUA techniques being used against her.
What is PUA?
Power Utility Application. “Electrify your woman with this 1 easy trick” bs stuff.
Pick up artist.
The difference in frequency of these sexist attitudes in gen z men compared with millennials was at most 5%. I believe your girlfriend’s experience but I don’t think it has much relevance to this study. Although generations are a terrible way to categorize data. I wish they weren’t used in research like this. I also wish they gave more country-specific data in this particular study.
That’s almost a litmus test for the Millennial/Gen Z border (for the US at least). Usually remembering 9/11 means you’re more on the Millennial side. Though generations are fuzzy and ill-defined.
For me, it’s if they can remember a world without Pokemon
I would like to go back to a world without Pokemon.
I disagree, that puts the last few years of Millennials into Gen Z though. That puts me into Gen Z and I’m a few years before the cutoff.
If you can’t remember a world before Pokemon than you can’t understand how amazing Pokemon truly are
I was 5 when Pokemon came to the US, so I don’t think it’s fair to say I remember a world before Pokemon. I have memories from before 5 sure, but nothing that counts as knowing what the world was like. And that’s not even counting hearing about Pokemon from my Japanese cousins before it came here.
I also don’t think it’s fair to say I can’t understand how amazing Pokemon are when those games dominated my whole childhood.
I guess it’s the difference between a child who lived in poverty suddenly getting rich versus a child born into wealth
What are you even talking about? My point is that’s not a good measure of the generational transition from Millennial to Gen Z. It’s the wrong timing.
Good luck getting married, LOL
This would be very worrisome if their generation was expected to enjoy a full lifespan and survive an increasingly grim and dystopian future…
I don’t understand this. I’m married. My wife is the coolest person I know. I wouldn’t dare try to control her. She is too much fun.
It’s pretty simple.
When life has no clearly defined gender roles, people will seek them out, and men and women both, are reverting back to 1950s expecations where gender roles were clearly defined.
I’m a single guy in my early 40s. The past 5 years on the dating market, most women I meet now want 1950s gender roles. These are often educated, liberal, successful women. But they have this fantasy that they will only be happy if they find a man who pays all the bills and bosses them around, and all think Don Draper is a ‘real man’. The idea of a partnership where you say split costs and responsibilities, is totally rejected as by them and they see it as surefire path to misery (because they are already paying their own bills and they are miserable doing so). They see their role in a relationship as to quit their career and be a homemaker/mother, and my job is to work 60-80 hours a week to earn a massive salary and pay for everything. It’s fantasy-escapism and they’d rather ‘hold out’ for this fantasy to escape their life… than try to actually be in a partnership where their daily responsibilities don’t go away…
And when they find out that as a man, I enjoy cooking, cleaning, keeping my house etc, they get really pissed off because they see me as ‘not needing a woman in my life’. No… shit. I don’t ‘need’ a woman. I want a partner to split chores and bills with and raise kids together with. I have no interest in working 80 hours a week to ‘provide’ and never seeing my wife/kids.
I think it’s weird too. Every couple I know has a partnership model, but the single women on the dating market who want that… are very rare. But 10 years ago, it was quite common and I met women who were looking for this, but the world has changed and people now are adopting these extremist beliefs as a coping mechanism for their unhappiness with their lives. The irony being I bet if these people got their 1950s relationships… they find out that makes them miserable too.
Are you dating women your own age? I’m a woman in my early 40s and have literally never met a woman my age who thought like this. If you’re dating women ten years younger than you you’ll be selecting for the type who likes to date older men - usually for exactly the reasons you complain about (they want someone to take care of them).
Ever since I turned 35 every women I meet wants this. I have never met a woman who wants an equal partner in dating since I was in my early 30s, over 10 years ago.
Yes I date women my own age. They are the ones who are the most vocal and adamant about it. When I meet women you are under 35, on rare occasional, they tend to be less aggressive about it. For example, women under 35 don’t ask me my salary on a first date, women over 40, almost always do. All they seem to care about is how much money I have and if I am going to give it to them. Like, they ask me to take them on expensive trips, buy them cars, and think going on $500 dinner takes should be a weekly event. They all have advanced degrees, PhDs, JDs, MDs.
And every time I talk about this, I get this comment. ‘oh you must only be dating shallow young women for their looks.’ No, I date average looking women who are my own age, and they almost exclusively want a 1950s style relationship, even when they are doctors, lawyers, etc. their ‘ultimate romantic fantasy’ is to quit their job and be ‘taken care of’.
I also live in Boston, the most educated city in the country, and yet all these educated successful women basically aspire to be financially dependent housewives. It baffles the hell out of me. I put in my profile on dating apps that I want an equal partner and I get weird messages about what loser I am from these women because a man’s job is to provide for her his woman and her career/job should be optional.
Last week I was on a date and this woman I was with told me she values her career and independence BUT she really is looking for a man who ‘take care of her’ such that she doesn’t have to work anymore. And I laughed and said that’s not what I am looking for, I want someone to split bills with and build a life together as a working couple and she got angry with me. Then when the check came she was like ‘WELL I GUESS I SHOULD SPLIT THE BIll’ all bitter and shit. It was miserable. This is like 90% of my dates, it’s the same stuff every time, it’s like they all copy pasted from the same script…
women’s social media is rife with this 1950s shit. all my friends and family are in partnerships where they both work and split bills and raise kids together. but on the singles dating market in my city, I never ever meet any such women who want that type of life. I probably should try to date at 25 year olds, because when I was 25 I was with a girlfriend who wanted to split bills and pay her own way. but in my life experience, once women hit 35 they decide they hate being independent career women and ‘deserve’ to be ‘taken care of’. when i was younger I never met women who talked that way.
I can’t argue against your lived experience, but it doesn’t match mine at all. Maybe they’re all sick of dating irresponsible losers and this is some misguided screening technique? Good luck out there, it sounds like you’re having a difficult time finding someone you like!
They think I’m an irresponsible loser because I don’t make 500K a year and own two vacation homes. I am on a ‘poverty’ wage of 150K and I own a two bed condo with two pets and a car. I’m clearly a failure at life! Especially because I worked my way up from a poor family rather than the bank of mom and dad buying me my condo. That also tends to REALLY piss them off.
What you describe doesn’t reflect reality in my region of the world or amongst any of the people I know. Not sure where you are but you’re making a lot of generalized statements that should be a hell of a lot more specific. Do you live in Amish country maybe?
No I live in upper class America.
I’m making statements about my life and experiences. And how human beings operate. Human beings need someone to tell them how to act, and what to do, and how to behave. They dislike not having that.
Gotta remember selection bias. The single women are (eternally) on the dating market because of their horrible views, the ones who aren’t horrible are not on the dating market anymore or only very very short.
it’s not selection bias, it’s what’s on the market.
unless you think I should start trying to date married women?
married women’s views aren’t relevant to single men because they aren’t available to date.
Wouldn’t that argument work the same way for men? To be clear, I’m not a fan of that argument for any gender. But fair is fair.
I’m polyam, so my experiences are quite different. I’m finding more married people looking for a third, which is awkward when I’m more of a “relationship anarchist” and don’t want to put my partners into tiers above/below each other (or be put into such tiers myself.)
No, men are obviously evil
People just want all the the benefits with none of the drawbacks. They are just selfish and greedy.
I often see the whole ‘monogamish’ nonsense now too. It basically means, I want all the benefits of monogamy, but when I also want to be able to bang other people when I want, but also you can’t do that because that would make me feel insecure…
I actaully did date someone like that. She wanted to date other people, but as soon as I started seeing other women she got very very angry and jealous and told me it was not ‘fair’. She was just a selfish asshole who wanted me to be monogamous to her, while she was no monogamous to me. I’ve met other women with this attitude too, but I once they express that nonsense I move on.
Poly is too much work and complexity for these people. They just want to be children who want to do what they feel without any consequences or responsibilities that something polyamory requires. And like children, they throw temper tantrums when they don’t get their way. They want to eat their ice cream on a hot sunny day and they are angry that it is melting too fast.
You’re absolutely right on that. Some people really just want the freedom for themselves, but not for their partners. Which is ridiculous. After all, “What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.” If someone hasn’t got the maturity it takes for polyamory, then they’re not ready for it.
I try to control my wife the same amount that she tries to control me, which is to say not much at all but we communicate expectations which we think are reasonable. Like yeah, have friends and hang out with them without me, but I’m gonna be pissed off if you stay out until 3am without checking in. Extreme example, but you get my point. We check in before planning/doing shit that affects each other, and once in a while there is a good reason for the answer to be no.
Communication is the #1 thing that’s kept my wife and I happy and together. I don’t think it’s “controlling” to let my wife know where I’m going, or for her to tell me where she is going, that’s just normal married couple stuff.
That’s because you’re a terrible husband.
It’s disgusting how proud you are about the sick gratification you get from forcing that poor women to use her tiny little lady brain for your own personal amusement.
Report to 4chan before it’s too late! They’ll help you set you straight. Make sure you have nudes handy as payment for their services.
