It doesn’t matter what the constitution says when the government chooses to ignore it.
When the social contract is null, then all the gloves must come off.
You’re forgetting the “Nobody is going to stop me” exemption. The constitution is just a piece of paper if nobody is willing to defend it.
If someone was in the process of actively murdering me, I would think it safe to assume they are aware that murder is illegal. If I tell them it’s illegal, they’re probably more likely to double down and make sure I’m dead so that I can’t be a witness.
Its not, republicans stacked the courts so they can violate the law and republicans in congress are cheering them on.
As if Trumps GeStaPo would care about the Constitution! The rule of law died in the US about a year ago.
You guys haven’t really had rights for a while, by the sounds of it.
Naw but we got Mountain Dew buckets, cheeseburgers, and AR-15s in high school! Wooohooo!!! Thank Jesus I’m not a pinko Commie!!!
Black people been saying. everyone else just refuses to listen
(except for native americans, they been saying it the longest, they just don’t have the presence of messaging because they’ve been pushed so far into the margins)
Yeah I’m Aussie, and as soon as I learned about the Philly police firebombing a black neighbourhood, I knew you guys were supremely fucked.
And yeah Native Americans called it. I’ve learned that how a government and society treats a minority, is how they can eventually treat everyone. Or put another way, any rights you think you have over the member of society with the least rights is illusory.
yup. a society is only as just as it treats its most marginalized member. everyone else is just on a waiting list
deleted by creator
It isn’t legal. And they haven’t changed the law. It’s just now their policy to ignore the law.
Right now they’re trying to “shock and awe” everyone into submission and compliance before the law catches up with them.
What do you want to bet at some point when ICE and Miller go too far that whistleblowers inside ICE dig up the lists of the recent hires and slip them off to the various states that they are active in, for the states to bring charges?
Good gravy, if I was working in an ICE office, you BET that surrpetitiously making backups of all the HR files documenting which people are going where, would be my main agenda.
Trump can pardon all he wants, but the states can still make these goose-stepping fuckers pay…
What do you want to bet at some point when ICE and Miller go too far that whistleblowers inside ICE dig up the lists of the recent hires and slip them off to the various states that they are active in, for the states to bring charges?
A short while back they murdered an innocent civilian by shooting her in the face and just recently kidnapped a 5 year old child.
If neither of those was “too far” then there is no “too far” for them. There will be no whistle blowers. ICE is evil.
A lot of people who could do more are still doing the math between being complicit in this and ruining their lives, which is a real possibility if they act before securing some kind of support from the opposition or a resistance movement gets more organized. They’ll have to be convinced the risk is worth it and action could result real change before they go for it.
The problem isn’t necessarily finding people opposed to what’s happening, but making them believe that change can happen and they’ll be alright in the end if they join the resistance.
I wouldn’t discount the possibility of whistleblowers. Even in Nazi Germany there were people who needed time to follow their conscience - those who only comply out of fear of personal consequences might still find the courage to do what is right.
I’m thinking it’s likely to happen once a point has been reached that the Trump Administration is distracted and/or weak enough that a whistleblower can come forwards and do so without ending up in a Federal prison. It’s not going to happen anytime soon, but once the cracks in the administration get too large to paint over…
There have already been whistleblowers.
Them rounding up people and denying them their fundamental rights was too far for me. I’ve tried organizing locally, with my friends, etc. to try and form a defensive community. No one seemed at all concerned. As well ICE isn’t openly operating in my area because Trump has basically admitted he’s doing this to blue states and cities. Mine is ruby red.
They are 100% going to leave these morons holding the bag. They are pulling shit like SHOWING them a hard copy of these orders and then keeping it so there is zero evidence linking their conduct back to their leadership. The buck stops with the dumbasses on the ground.
Dumbasses Indeed…
https://www.wired.com/story/ice-agents-are-doxing-themselves/
Man, “secret police” went from hyperbole to reality REALLY fucking fast.
There was just a leak of 4500 ICE agents.
There’s a bunch of proud boys and other criminals. The state should just adopt a mandatory policy of stopping any ice agents that they find unmasking them and verifying that they have clean records before letting them go or resting them.
If you havent read it, Sun Tzu’s Art of War is a real thinker.
What page is it on actually? I have one by my beside along with Machiavelli the prince.
Im not sure what you are asking, but i found this summary on google which looks pretty good if you want a quick refresher.
It says ICE agents are allowed to forcibly enter a person’s home using an administrative warrant if a judge has issued a “final order of removal.” Administrative warrants permit officers and agents to make arrests and are different from judicial warrants, which judges or magistrates sign allowing entry into homes.
It’s basically a new legal theory (like the bush torture memos you can just make them up) and they’re claiming the preexisting administrative warrant is good enough
The article says it’s also not a search warrant, which backs up their claim saying they can enter because they aren’t searching.
Which is stupid.
But if it’s not a search warrant, and they start doing this, I wonder if there’s some way to protect yourself by requiring finding you in the house to constitute a search?
Like what if you attached a bookshelf to your bedroom door. And you had to move a book to access the handle?
That’s a search?
Maybe that’s a way to try to continue legally protecting yourself within their illegal entry? Or something like that anyway.
They’re already ignoring law. Stop looking for loopholes and start looking for safe shooting positions.
Pretty sure a ‘hidden’ room is a good spot to shoot from if that’s the decision you’re going to make.
It will make it more obvious they are about to enter it somehow.
edit: Also boobytraps would probably be effective at that point as well.
Just remember, an annoyed invader that has no external challenge can just set your house on fire and smoke you out, boobytraps or no.
You think ICE is going to go as far as lighting houses on fire to get someone to exit?
Not necessarily ICE, but 1. I wouldn’t put it past them. and 2. If even a lame-ass civil war largely in name only erupts, you bet your ass fascist pieces of shit would torch someone’s house before they put themselves in actual proved danger.
Problem with that idea is that they don’t actually care about any of the technicalities one way or the other, they just tossed out a somewhat plausible sounding “justification” to have something to point to. Their idiots will believe the justification regardless, and everyone else’s time can be wasted arguing about it.
I mean ya, if they’re coming into the house they’re going to come and get ya administrative warrant or not (edit: because we all know they’ll come in even without that), and if you can’t get a lawyer to prevent yourself from being deported before they deport you, none of this does any good.
But if you can manage to get as far as they entered, and had to search to find you, and they didn’t just deport you anyway before being able to get in front of a court, it would make a difference in theory.
If they don’t respect the 4th amendment they get the second amendment
“Instead, the disclosure claims that the memo was rolled out in a secretive manner in which some agents were verbally briefed while others were allowed to view it but not keep a copy,” Blumenthal said. “It was reportedly clear that anyone who openly spoke out against this new directive would be fired.”
Seems like they know it’s not
Wow. ELI5 on Lemmy is way different from ELI5 on Reddit.
Way better imo
The rule of law has ceased to exist in the US. It has been replaced by the rule of power.
You either get used to no longer have rights, or you can start to get them back.
Yup.
Those of us with functional brains kept telling everyone else without that it can and will happen here. They didn’t think so.
Now it’s happening here.
It’s a slow boil, so people will keep denying. But hey, women don’t have the same rights they had a few years ago. Now due process is gone. What’s next?
Now to be precise those women’s rights were taken away legally as they were not codified anywhere in a lasting manner.
Well yeah.
A lot of what the Nazis did was legal, too.
Particularly at the beginning when they started passing laws to persecute Jews and other minorities. All done legally.
Like when the U.S. didn’t let women or blacks vote or own land. All legal.
Oh you can tell them to piss off. But they have more guns than you do.
It doesn’t matter whether it’s illegal. If you don’t have rule of law, which is the reality that MAGA has us living in, then all that matters is if you can get away with it. If you can’t or won’t be held to account, then there is no law
