Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi said Beijing cannot accept any country acting as the “world’s judge” after the United States captured Venezuela’s President Nicolas Maduro.
The world’s second-largest economy has provided Venezuela with an economic lifeline since the U.S. and its allies ramped up sanctions in 2017, purchasing roughly $1.6 billion worth of goods in 2024, the most recent full-year data available.
Almost half of China’s purchases were crude oil, customs data shows, while its state-owned oil giants had invested around $4.6 billion in Venezuela by 2018, according to data from the American Enterprise Institute think tank, which tracks Chinese overseas corporate investment.
It also cannot accept others acting as judges when it finally invades Taiwan.
Lmao literally while supporting Russia for doing the exact same thing but like a billion times worse.
For anyone that thinks otherwise I guarantee this opens the door for China to begin their assault on Taiwan.
100% agree, also China’s outrage is in name only. They provided 1.6 Billion in relief in the form of buying oil lol.
this is how things work, and some people seem incapable of understanding that.
You exercise a given power, and it gives others justification to use power in the same way. Laws be damned, the motivation is there.
China claims Taiwan is theirs. Invading their own country to free it doesn’t really need any extra motive (even if there is) like what Trump needed, and is not playing world police.
Oh, so the US should have claimed Venezuela was US property, then they aren’t playing world police!
I’m not so sure it does. China is openly arguing against Trumps logic here, and the US just did demonstrate their military is still highly effective. The US seventh fleet hasn’t moved away from Taiwan, and Trump is clearly signalling he intends to keep China down.
I’d argue Xi is not happy Trump decided to actually do something like this, because it increased the risk of his plans with Taiwan as well now that the US is openly hostile and MAGA cheers it on.
China needed him to keep up the whole peace pretense and for MAGA to stay on board with that. Now that that’s gone, Trump has cleared the way for more military intervention.
and the US just did demonstrate their military is still highly effective
hmmmm sucker punching Venezuela here is not the flex you seem to think it is
the USA loves to bat weaker military powers around but they have been shown to be crushed by peasants in the long run…
In a matter of hours the US kidnapped the president of Venezuela, from his house on an army base, taking zero casualties. I don’t think there’s many militaries around that can beat that. It’s not the same as capturing Putin or Xi, sure, but it’s no trifle either.
you’ve never been to Venezuela, have you?
How many other heads of state do you remember being kidnapped from their palace, like from anywhere?
Of course Venezuela is no China or Russia and doesn’t compare to the US military, but they did have fairly modern Russian-made AA installations, all of which were successfully disabled or destroyed. And again: zero casualties.
You expect the operation would be successful, sure. But not as perfectly executed as it was.
How many other heads of state do you remember being kidnapped from their palace, like from anywhere?
how many have been tried?
Which is the point, it’s rarely tried because it’s very risky and unlikely to succeed or achieve your goals. The US military however was capable enough.
From China’s perspective (and in theory, Taiwan’s perspective), invading Taiwan isn’t the same, because they both officially recognize One China, they just disagree about who’s in charge.
It would more akin to USA invading Puerto Rico, if the governor of PR asserted that they were in fact the proper leaders of the USA.
China also knows that other countries don’t exactly share that perspective. And it certainly won’t persuade Trump to not continue his anti-China policies.
MAGA is actually currently having a bit of a crisis of confidence. One of the promises Trump made was to stop the empire building and international interference. Now he’s going around causing an international incident every 45 minutes.
He has gone from saying that it was a single strike, to threatening more strikes against Venezuela, to threatening yet other countries in the last 24 hours.
The thing about bootlickers is that they love licking boot. As long as we’re winning and not losing, they’ll obediently fall in line. If things turn to shit, like it did in Iraq & Afghanistan, they’ll pretend they were always against it.
A random Xitter account crying foul isn’t a sign of widespread crisis of confidence. Only 6% of Republicans don’t approve of the Maduro kidnapping. His approval rating went up a bit since the kidnapping (38% -> 42%).
His base, by and large, support the warmongering.
cult members gotta cult
Maga gets hard from a show of strength, regardless of what form that takes. Even if it means cannibalising some of their own.
In the USA, this is known as the “old switcheroo”.
Our politicians are infamous for doing the exact opposite of their platform.
For example, Reagan ran on sealing the borders and isolationism, only to declare amnesty for border hoppers and revel in international intervention.
Biden ran on increasing the minimum wage and other working class American concerns. Did he do this? No.
Our major parties aren’t actually concerned with their platforms, that’s performative.
Maduro and Trump are friends
Maduro gets to escape his country and save face instead of being assassinated or executed.
Trump gets to manufacture a conflict so he can start martial law and become a dictator, and to distract from us learning he came inside little girls.
You keep making up this shit in every post. Do you get paid to do so, CIA stooge?
It would appear that the US got tired of all the jokes comparing them to the movie Idiocracy, so they decided to make themselves into Team America: World Police instead.
I mean…that’s why that movie was made to begin with…
Trey Parker and Matt Stone should make the movie free for the week in honor of Team America World Police being back in action.
Swap police with gangsters and i agree.
All of this has happened before. All of this will happen again.
:(
Found the Cylon.
No toasters in these parts, my fellow biological human.
deleted by creator
Translation: An insane man has most of the nukes in the world and is ignoring international law.
Yeah, sure kid
Oh, not just them. The fascists want to invade all North America and South America. We could very depressingly actually find ourselves on opposite sides of an armed conflict sometime soon. I mean, I’m a disabled trans woman and I am somewhat doubtful that anyone will be depending on me to shoot a gun, but you know. Maybe more like we could find ourselves being shot at by each country’s respective combat drones.
We agree, so let’s discuss the Chinese police stations in countries that are clearly not China.
Let’s discuss the American military bases in countries that are clearly not America.
At least the host country agreed to those
There’s real things to criticize, why pick something stupid?
same way I agree to give up my wallet when getting mugged?
Yeah… Maybe ask the good folks of Okinawa whether they have ever agreed to American military bases.
You can’t tolerate the intolerant, Japan lost WWII and had to be demilitarized. It’s one thing to advocate for Remilitarize Japan, it’s another thing entirely to ask their proxy military to leave them defenceless.
Sweet summer child
Agreement under duress isn’t really agreement
Ahahah. The host country agreed to those. That’s priceless…
Hard power is often leveraged by state actors to coerce agreement / consent. It doesn’t necessarily invalidate consent but it certainly obscures it.
After WW2 Japan and Germany, for example, were not in a position to say no to US bases. I wouldn’t consider that legitimate consent.
according to data from the American Enterprise Institute
Don’t ask who pays their bills
While I agree you always need to look at who is saying what and what their motivations are, China has been investing in Venezuela, just as they have in many other countries.
Investing in Venezuela instead of sanctioning them until they bow to your will? Terrible.
The largest outside investment in Venezuela has come from California based multinationals. China’s a very recent entrant into the Venezuelan market, owing in large part to the rising tide of US sanctions that prevents western businesses from doing the kind of trade they were already enthusiastic about.
Incidentally, the American Enterprise Institute operates as a lobbyist on behalf of many of those California businesses.
Nobody is crying wolf here, this is just a statement of imports and exports based on publicly available data giving context to China’s interests in the region. Is admitting that China works for their own geopolitical interests too much for you? We’re now down to dismissing public customs and OPEC data because engaging in foreign economic interests is a little too close to American imperialism for comfort?
‘Despicable cunts accuse despicable cunts of being despicable cunts’
They’re not wrong but also the last thing those assholes want is anyone judging their shitty behavior. Ulterior Motives and all.
Unless it’s China whose the judge, of course. They seem to find no issue judging the Uygurs as needing to die and Taiwan as their property, or the the South China Sea as their waters, or all the fish in the world as theirs to make extinct.
different from other imperialists nations, how?
or supporting Russia judging Ukraine, also totally ok.
They seem to find no issue judging the Uygurs as needing to die
Are they killing Uyghurs by the millions or teaching them Mandarin?
So much of the hysteria around China seems to stem from domestic campaigns of infrastructure development. The Three Gourges Dam, the rapid expansion of urban infrastructure, development of schools and hospitals in the historically rural corners of the country, expansion of universities, trade with East Africa, the BRI - all described as brutal forms of colonial oppression by a savage and sadistic Far-Left Totalitarian Communist government.
Nobody described Bolsonaro’s Brazil in these terms, as his administration clear cut the Amazon and rapidly displaced tens of thousands of migrants. Nobody described The Phillipines or Indonesia this way, even as Red Tagging was used as an excuse for vigilante executions and toxic dumping sent cancer rates stratospheric. Hell, its hard enough to get Israel described in these terms in any major western publication of record, and they’re outright shooting children in the head before labeling them “Hamas Terrorists”.
Why are liberals so eager to re-characterize literacy programs as a form of holocaust? Why do they seem so gleeful at the prospect of a China-Taiwan hot war? Why do we have a President threatening to invade Venezuela, Nigeria, and Greenland all at once, while his biggest “critics” complain that he’s not bellicose enough?
Fucking wild times.
because you dont want attention when you eventually want to take over taiwan
And china are right in this case. They’re just also assholes
Not as much as America tho.
People often forget all the countries America has bombed and destabilized in the past.
I think they’re wrong. Their statement is basically that international law is meaningless and that they’re free to wage war without consequences.
This was probably their endgame from the beginning, since they promoted and helped reelect Donald Trump. If it came out that Trump, Maduro, Putin, and Xi Jinping all conspired to make these events happen, I would not at all be surprised.
Why? Maduro is such small beans compared to them? It’s low hanging fruit.
The point is, as China is illustrating, that if every world power does what they want then international laws don’t apply to any of them, as a way to justify their current occupations and use of force as well as future invasions.
They’re saying “the world won’t protect you, ao why protect the world?”
Well, international law is meaningless. As trump has just shown us.
And Putin with Ukraine. And Xi with Hong Kong.
Were you expecting the consequences to be instantaneous? Like, what, simultaneous nuclear strikes in retalliation?
Even if proceedings started immediately there wouldn’t be changes to trade for weeks at a minimum and no sentencing for months or even years, but honestly proceedings aren’t likely to start until the individuals responsible lose political power.
Sanctions against US like the ones against Russia.
And China. Yes.
In spite of many of its economic and military misadventures, China hasn’t invaded anyone as of yet.
That distinction is still important or else v shud sanction every country.
well not invaded anyone of recent. the last official one would be the short one in vietnam after vietnam ended the Khmer Rouge. this of course was nearly half a century ago though, so a lot of poeple online wouldn’t recall it because it wouldn’t be part of their generation.
China is occupying Tibet and Hong Kong and claiming it owns Taiwan as well. It also frequently sends warships through seas owned by the Philippines where it has been illegally fishing and destroying Philippines fishing vessels. A couple of weeks ago Chinese authorities refused an Indian passport because they claimed that part of India belonged to China.
Also, China waged war on it’s own people in Tienanmen Square.
China is already sanctionned. There is no sanctions on the United Snakes
Welcome to the discussion. Glad you’re all caught up. Be sure to check for updates after more than 2 days have passed, likely 2 to 3 weeks.
Iraq was long before tramp
At least with Iraq the US pretended to be following international norms. The presented lies to the UN to justify their actions, they gathered allies into a “coalition.”
I can’t believe how you make their point better for them.
It was always a farce.
Fuck the US.
putin was quite happy to declare this multipolar law-free world. I hope he at least enjoys it, because I won’t.
You’re getting downvotes but it might be because some people are surprised that Xi Jingping would support Trump but I’ve gathered some evidence it might be true.
For starters we look at TikTok. Regarding TikTok this article is the most damning: https://www.theinformation.com/articles/how-tiktok-courted-conservatives-before-trumps-win (archive/non-paywall: https://archive.is/TUjo9)
The top leaders pushed through content moderation changes that made TikTok more accepting of some conservative views on the fairness of elections or transgender rights, including by updating policies on banned content or enforcing them differently.
I hate the way they worded that. What they really mean is allowing the big lie (false claims the 2020 election was rigged) and transphobia.
See: https://www.theverge.com/politics/656717/trump-tiktok-ban-maga-influencers (archive link: https://archive.is/DMOLf)
MAGA influencers also view TikTok as a relatively reliable platform to publish pro-Trump content without fear that their accounts will get demonetized, restricted, or worse, deactivated.
Also see: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/maga-republicans-defend-tiktok-conservative-platform-fate-hangs-balance-supreme-court (archive link: https://archive.is/RGBC8)
“Trump won the election because he listened to first-time voters like myself and joined TikTok to get his message to us directly,” RNC Youth Advisory Council Chair Brilyn Hollyhand told Fox News Digital of the impending ban.
President Donald Trump “pleaded” with China’s Xi Jinping during a 2019 summit to help his reelection prospects, according to a scathing new book by former Trump adviser John Bolton that accuses the president of being driven by political calculations when making national security decisions.
Then we cannot forget about all the Chinese bots who post online. “China is pushing divisive political messages online using fake U.S. voters” https://www.npr.org/2024/09/03/nx-s1-5096151/china-tiktok-x-fake-voters-influence-campaign Says it very clearly. They used the same strategy Russia did.
China shares an interest with Russia in weakening the US and Europe.
Also, TikTok voluntarily went offline right before the ban’s due date, but then went right back online thanking Donald Trump 14 hours later without Trump having to do anything. I’ve also seen how they treat Donald Trump on the other psyops like Hexbear, he was the favored candidate by far for Tankies.
I think I know what you’re talking about! The people who pretend to be “far-left”, socialist or communist but for some bizarre reason they keep supporting Russia.
I had an experience with one of those people recently. I asked one of those people point blank do you support Trump and they completely dogged the question. Clicking on profiles of these types of people I notice they also never denounce Trump or Republicans or do so very rarely.
I actually deeply regretfully used to be somewhat of a Trump supporter so now I’m very sensitive to people who may be secretly Trump supporters or those who have similar characteristics. Those “tankie” type people really peg my MAGA-meter. It’s almost like when someone has an abusive ex they tend to notice certain things more afterwards (I wish I could word this sentence better but hopefully people can understand).
Ultimately what makes tankies and MAGA similar even if they are not secretly supporting Trump or a bot is belief persistence when there is contrary and reputable evidence and belief in conspiracy theories. Part of what helped me escape MAGA is media literacy and realizing that if someone presents reputable information that contradicts what I believe, I should change my beliefs not plug my ears and regurgitate conspiracy theories based on some random comment like a screenshot of a screenshot of a 4chan post or just saying nonsense like “I don’t trust the MSM”.
If it came out that Trump, Maduro, Putin, and Xi Jinping all conspired
I think it’s more likely that Trump asked what he could get away with regarding seizing a bunch of money from another country, and Venezuela was a low-risk, high-reward.
Marjorie Taylor Green posted about how invading Venezuela is a terrible idea.
I hate it when I agree with Marjorie Taylor Green.
It’s as good to agree as it is to disagree. It’s not good to disagree for the sake of it, so you’re doing good 😊
that’s perfect. chef’s kiss.
China is hypocritical as FUCK
They take Tibet, they take Hong Kong despite practically the entire island coming out to say no thanks, they threaten Taiwan every second day, and the only reason they haven’t taken Taiwan is because they wouldn’t have been able to hold it against the west
Now they see how weak Europe is and the nutter in command of the US, and their plans have accelerated, this is simply an opportunity to further push propaganda on something they were always going to do
On top of that I actually wouldn’t mind if we had a judge that aligns closer to American/Western values
China is literally right next to the totalitarian dystopian hellscape that is North Korea
Executions for watching south korean tv, 3 generations of jail as punishment for committing crimes
i would have no problems if even china which is not great even by itself could bring some sense to north korea
Removed by mod
Common mrdown L. Learn how to spell, buddy.
Ok language police. All i said is right . That guy is a big hypocrite and a genovide supporter. What’s your problem with what I said?
Even if so (I don’t know this user or their beliefs), what does that have to do with the current discussion? All I can see is you going full aggro against them completely unprompted. You addressed nothing about what they said, just immediately leaped to insults and accusations. The fact you didn’t bother checking your spelling just makes you look like you saw this user and just went off on them without a second thought out of anger. This is something I have seen you do time and time again.
Did you reply to the wrong comment?
You know we’re talking about China right?
I have the right to expand about the topic of hypocrisy. What is the problem with calling out a genocide supporter hypocrite?
??? who are you?
They’re also trying to erase the Cantonese Language from existence… 🫤
Yikes chill a little… You actually believe that nonsense about North Korea?
The nonsense about the dictatorship in North Korea?
the only reason they haven’t taken Taiwan is because they wouldn’t have been able to hold it against the west
Eeeeh I’m not so sure about that anymore.
I suspect losing trading partners is the biggest deterrent. As soon as controlling the supply of Taiwanese microchips becomes more financially viable than making billions of tons of cheap goods every year, China will take Taiwan. And the US naval fleet will either be cruise missiled to the bottom of the ocean or we’ll just quietly walk back our threats to defend it.
Removed by mod
Yes, they are hypocritical but they are also right - a unilateral invasion like that is baaad:
.Edit: image is directed at China, not ikt.
China is the world’s largest economy by every meaningful metric. No serious economist uses GDP as a metric for actual economic production. Can we please at least use GDP (PPP)?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)
It’s still not a good metric but at least it actually allows a means to compare countries to one another more accurately.
The US economy is 10 major tech corporations doing essentially this with AI right now.
China has 4x the population of the US. It should have 4x the GDP of the US to be truly equivalent.
You might want to let the people that studied econ beyond a lemonade stand just talk next time. You don’t need to type out every thought in your head.
You just gave the ultimate dumb guy response. Congratulations.
We’re discussing Calculus and you just responded with “yeah, well 2 + 2 = 4. I don’t know why those letters are in your math with that weird squiggly line at the start.”.
You clearly have no idea what we’re even discussing in this thread.
No serious economist uses GDP as a metric for actual economic production. Can we please at least use GDP (PPP)?
In terms of flexing on foreign countries on the international stage, though, raw GDP (or at least imports and exports) is pretty important.
The PPP calculation comparing China to the United States may tell us a lot about how much a resident of either country can expect to experience using the local currency domestically, but if we’re talking about influence over a third country, in that third country’s local currency, then I think each respective PPP back home doesn’t matter as much.
If we’re not comparing the ability of a citizen to buy things with the fruit of their labor. What are we comparing?
I get what you’re saying. But it comes down to a fundamental problem with liberal (using the classical sense of the word) economist and what they are “flexing” about.
The “economy” to the average voter is how much the groceries and rent are.
Not even mentioning the “eating shit” problem of GDP. GDP PPP is far more meaningful to quality of life. Though still flawed. The normal person isn’t trying to understand the power of a currency on the world stage. They are using it to buy eggs.
If we’re not comparing the ability of a citizen to buy things with the fruit of their labor. What are we comparing?
In this particular case? I think we’re comparing Chinese and American ability to project economic influence (from trade or aid, to outright bribes or coercion or boycotts or sanctions or everything in between) over Venezuela.
The normal person
But the normal person has nothing to do with governments dealing with other governments on the global stage. And that’s what this story is about, Venezuela being caught between two competing visions of their future in the international order.
If a country wants to build an airport in their capital city using the resources of foreign governments seeking to influence them, the question isn’t about how many eggs the citizens of those countries can buy in their home turf, but about how much concrete and steel and heavy machinery those other countries can provide in the country considering offers.
Do you think America competes at all in its ability to produce heavy machinery, concrete, and steel when compared to China?
We are far beyond the GDP vs. GDP(PPP) that started this. But, you brought it up. The US’s main problem is it’s lack of industrial production. It’s an almost entirely finance based economy. Which is something that causes its GDP to be heavily inflated. The AI companies trading the same billions in a circle with no actual material production happening in the country right now. The US economy is built on financial speculation. China’s is built on industrial production. Something GDP doesn’t account for at all.
That was my entire frustration with using GDP as a metric in the first place. I said “at least use GDP(PPP)” because at least it takes into account the populations purchasing power of goods.
On the world stage, as an economic power, the US is losing to China. It’s why it’s using its military to invade South American countries that trade with China. It has no real way to compete. So it’s falling back on it’s methods of imperialism.
We are far beyond the GDP vs. GDP(PPP) that started this.
No, you started talking about PPP in response to a news story that described the United States and China competing over influence over the Venezuelan economy: Chinese aid and investment in response to United States sanctions. Those are essentially going to be dollar denominated, and PPP doesn’t matter. I’ve been saying from the beginning that you were wrong to bring PPP into the discussion, because this discussion, in this thread, isn’t about domestic consumption in either China or the U.S.
The US’s main problem is it’s lack of industrial production.
Again, when talking about the effects of sanctions and foreign aid and investment, we should be talking about transactions that occur in the currency at issue. If China wants to provide aid to Venezuela in RMB, Venezuela will either need to spend that on Chinese producers or exchange for another currency to spend elsewhere (including Venezuelan Bolivars being spent domestically). If there’s going to be a currency exchange, then PPP of the aid providing nation doesn’t matter. A million USD from China is worth the exact same amount as a million USD from the U.S.
On the world stage, as an economic power, the US is losing to China.
I think if we’re talking about on the world stage, as an economic power, the interconnected West is best understood as a power bloc. U.S. inconsistency and unpredictability on things like Russian sanctions actually show the limits of U.S. unilateral power while still showing the power of the broader Western order. Yes, China and Russia want to provide the world with an alternative multipolar order, and fragmentation of the Western powers may open up opportunities for that vision, but that competition is playing out along alliances, not isolated nations. In any event, PPP doesn’t have anything to do with that particular competition.
We’re just going to have to agree to disagree. I’m not going to bang my head against the wall trying to explain it to you. But I’ll give it one more shot.
The fact that you see PPP as only relevant in a bubble inside the country is just idiotic. China PRODUCES things. Literally most of its aid and initiatives are in the form of resources and infrastructure projects. There is no USD involved. That’s literally the entire Belt and Road project.
I’m sorry. But it seems like you’re trying to project what you know about US trade and neoliberal economic policies onto China. You clearly know enough about US trade and how it uses the dollar for dominance on world markets. But China doesn’t have to play that game anymore. That’s literally the shift in global economic trade that has happened. The world is not being held hostage by US dollar dominance anymore. They have an alternative in China.
And PPP is a much better means of showing why this is. It’s BECAUSE China actually makes shit. It’s not just a finance and consumption economy. It makes stuff more affordable for its population AND it’s able to use this same massive industrial power to work on industrial projects with other countries.
You are explaining a world that existed 20-30 years ago.
We’re just going to have to agree to disagree.
I think that’s right. To summarize, here’s where I think we agree and disagree:
We agree: GDP is not a particularly good metric for measuring international economic influence.
We disagree: You think adjusting GDP by PPP makes it better for this context, and I think that adjustment makes it even worse.
We agree: Exports matter for discussing economic power on the international stage.
We disagree: I think imports and investment also matter. You clearly don’t, by dismissing them as mere consumption and financial engineering.
We agree: United States economic power overseas is in decline, including in the hegemony of the US Dollar, and its importance/influence through organizations like the World Bank, IMF, WTO, or even things like the SWIFT banking network.
We disagree: I think the United States is still much, much stronger than China on global economic influence. The lines may cross, where China overtakes the United States, but I think that would be in the future, whereas your comment suggests you believe those lines crossed in the past.
In the end, a country like Venezuela wants to sell barrels of oil to buyers, for a good price. That means things like U.S. sanctions (especially when enforced by the entire west) will hurt more than Chinese aid helps. At least as of 2026.
Naw, OpenAi pays oracle to agree to eat the crap Oracle pays nvidia to agree to eat the crap Nvidia pays OpenAi to agree to eat the crap
The consumers eat the crap as they reduce the memory and video cards available to the public.
Okay but what metric should we use for the average American median voter who just wants to see China enter a wrestling ring with pyrotechnics and then rock and roll music plays and we see the US hit them with a steel chair.
Even that might be too nuanced and complex for the average American voter.
China should dump all of its U.S. treasuries
They literally can’t. Nor can the US dump theirs.
The US, the EU, and China are economically tied to one another. One of the reasons there hasn’t been a shooting war between the East and West is how much we depend on the other’s economy. Without foreign backed assets, there’s nothing to trade against.
Chinese made goods are bought with American dollars. If they’re not putting them back in to the US, there’s no need to take them in the first place. And then who, exactly, would China be making all that crap for?
They literally can’t.
That really hasn’t stopped the US government recently.
