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Why does this have so many up votes
Check the post title ;)
SSD ≠ HDD
Never change pedantic Internet, never change!
no thanks Seagate. the trauma of losing my data because of a botched firmware with a ticking time bomb kinda put me off your products for life.
see you in hell.
Can someone recommend me a hard drive that won’t fail immediately? Internal, not SSD, from which cheap ones will die even sooner, and I need it for archival reasons, not speed or fancy new tech, otherwise I have two SSDs.
My WD Red Pros have almost all lasted me 7+ years but the best thing (and probably cheapest nowadays) is a proper 3-2-1 backup plan.
Hard drives aren’t great for archival in general, but any modern drive should work. Grab multiple brands and make at least two copies. Look for sales. Externals regularly go below $15/tb these days.
Word for the wise, those externals usually won’t last 5+ years of constant use as an internal.
I’ve got 6 in a random mix of brands (Seagate and WD) 8-16Tb that are all older than that. Running 24/7 storing mostly random shit I download. Pulled one out recently because the USB controller died. Still works in a different enclosure now.
I’d definitely have a different setup for data I actually cared about.
If you’re relying on one hard drive not failing to preserve your data you are doing it wrong from the jump. I’ve got about a dozen hard drives in play from seagate and WD at any given time (mostly seagate because they’re cheaper and I don’t need speed either) and haven’t had a failure yet. Backblaze used to publish stats about the hard drives they use, not sure if they still do but that would give you some data to go off. Seagate did put out some duds a while back but other models are fine.
The back blaze stats were always useless because they would tell you what failed long after that run of drives was available.
There are only 3 manufactures at this point so just buy one or two of each color and call it a day. ZFS in raid z2 is good enough for most things at this point.
I think refurbished enterprise drives usually have a lot of extra protection hardware that helps them last a very long time. Seagate advertises a mean time to failure on their exos drives of ~200 years with a moderate level of usage. I feel like it would almost always be a better choice to get more refurbished enterprise drives than fewer new consumer drives.
I personally found an 8tb exos on serverpartdeals for ~$100 which seems to be in very good condition after checking the SMART monitoring. I’m just using it as a backup so there isn’t any data on it that isn’t also somewhere else, so I didn’t bother with redundancy.
I’m not an expert, but this is just from the research I did before buying that backup drive.
but then wd and their fake red nas drives with smr tech?
what else we have?
Wait… fake? I just bought some of those.
they were selling wd red (pro?) drives with smr tech, which is known to be disastrous for disk arrays because both traditional raid and zfs tends to throw them out. the reason for that is when you are filling it up, especially when you do it quickly, it won’t be able to process your writes after some time, and write operations will take a very long time, because the disk needs to rearrange its data before writing more. but raid solutions just see that the drive is not responding to the write command for a long time, and they think that’s because the drive is bad.
it was a few years ago, but it was a shitfest because they didn’t disclose it, and people were expecting that nas drives will work fine in their nas.
they were selling wd red (pro?) drives with smr tech
Didn’t they used to have only one “Red” designation? Or maybe I’m hallucinating. I thought “Red Pro” was introduced after that curfuffel to distinguish the SMR from the CMR.
I don’t know, because haven’t been around long enough, but yeah possibly they started using the red pro type there
I’ve had a couple random drop from my array recently, but they were older so I didn’t think twice about it. Does this permafry them or can you remove from the array and reinitiate for it to work?
well, it depends. if they were dropped just because they are smr and were writing slowly, I think they are fine. but otherwise…
what array system do you use? some raid software, or zfs?
Windows Server storage solutions. I took them out of the array and they still weren’t recognized in Disk Management so I assume they’re shot. It was just weird having 2 fail the same way.
I don’t have experience with windows server, but that indeed sounds like these are dead. you could check them with some pendrive bootable live linux, whether it sees them, like gparted’s edition, in case windows just hides them because it blacklisted them or something
Elaborate please?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/whats-behind-the-infamous-seagate-bsy-bug/
this thread has multiple documented instances of poor QA and firmware bugs Seagate has implemented at the cost of their own customers.
my specific issue was even longer ago, 20+ years. there was a bug in the firmware where there was a buffer overflow from an int limit on runtime. it caused a cascade failure in the firmware and caused the drive to lock up after it ran for the maximum into limit. this is my understanding of it anyway.
the only solution was to purchase a board online for the exact model of your HDD and swap it and perform a firmware flash before time ran out. I think you could also use a clip and force program the firmware.
at the time a new board cost as much as a new drive, finances of which I didn’t have at the time.
eventually I moved past the 1tb of data I lost, but I will never willingly purchase another Seagate.
In my case, 10+years ago I had 6 * 3tb Seagate disks in a software raid 5. Two of them failed and it took me days to force it back into the raid and get some of the data off. Now I use WD and raid 6.
I read 3 or 4 years ago that it was just the 3tb reds I used had a high failure rate but I’m still only buying WDs
I had a single red 2TB in an old tivo roamio for almost a decade.
Pulled out this weekend, and finally tested it. Failed.
I was planning to move my 1.5T music collection to it. Glad I tested it first, lol.
Thanks, yeah that makes sense.
Some of Seagate’s drives have terrible scores on things like Blackblaze. They are probably the worst brand, but also generally the cheapest.
I have been running a raid of old Seagate barracuda’s for years at things point, including a lot of boot cycles and me forcing the system off because Truenas has issues or whatnot and for some fucking reason they won’t die.
I have had a WD green SSD that I use for Truenas boot die, I had some WD external drive have its controller die (the drive inside still work) and I had some crappy WD mismatched drives in a raid 0 for my Linux ISO’s and those failed as well.
Whenever the Seagate start to die, I guess ill be replacing them with Toshiba’s unless somebody has another suggestion.
Every manufacturer has made a product that failed.
but not every manufacturer has had class action lawsuits filed against their continued shitty products.
I had a similar experience with Samsung. I had a bunch of evo 870 SSDs up and die for no reason. Turns out, it was a firmware bug in the drive and they just need an update, but the update needs to take place before the drive fails.
I had to RMA the failures. The rest were updated without incident and have been running perfectly ever since.
I’d still buy Samsung.
I didn’t lose a lot of data, but I can certainly understand holding a grudge on something like that. From the other comments here, hate for Seagate isn’t exactly rare.
I can certainly understand holding grudges against corporations. I didn’t buy anything from Sony for a very long time after their fuckery with George Hotz and Nintendo’s latest horseshit has me staying away from them, but that was a single firmware bug that locked down hard drives (note, the data was still intact) a very long time ago. Seagate even issued a firmware update to prevent the bug from biting users it hadn’t hit yet, but firmware updates at the time weren’t really something people thought to ever do, and operating systems did not check for them automatically back then like they do now.
Seagate fucked up but they also did everything they could to make it right. That matters. Plus, look at their competition. WD famously lied about their red drives not being SMR when they actually were. And I’ve only ever had WD hard drives and sandisk flash drives die on me. And guess who owns sandisk? Western Digital!
I guess if you must go with a another company, there’s the louder and more expensive Toshiba drives but I have never used those before so I know nothing about them aside from their reputation for being loud.
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finally i’ll be able to self-host one piece streaming
Seagate so how long before it fails?
In my experience, not all Seagates will fail but most HDD’s that fail will be Seagates.
Because Seagate sell the most drives and all drives fail?
The thing is I’m a data hoarder who buys lots of HDD’s; both new and used. I have only bought a few Seagates. It’s always the Seagates that are fucked. I had a Toshiba and Western Digital fail on me but I have had 5 Seagates fail on me. Could be a coincidence, sure but the brand I have bought the fewest of had the most failures. I recognize this is not scientific in any way. I recently bought a brand new 8TB Seagate Barracuda and its still going strong. I hope if lasts a good while. My oldest drive is a 1TB Hitachi (RIP) from 2008. I can’t wait for 8TB SSD’s to become cheaper.
Nah, as a fellow data hoarder you’re 100% correct. I have a couple of dozen disks, and I’ve had failures from both Seagate and WD, but the Seagates have failed much more often. For the past couple of years, I’ve only purchased WD for this reason. I’m down to two Seagate drives now.
I feel like many people with a distaste for WD got burned by the consumer drives (especially the WD Greens). WD’s DC line is so good though, especially HC530.
Any hint about the ironwolfs?
I’ve had my 16TB ironwolf pros spinning for 5 years in my NAS, no issues. People love to trash Seagate but I can’t say I’ve had any issues. I also have 6x10TB barracuda pros and they’re fine too, for about 10 years.
I mostly buy new Toshiba drives now. The WD blue drives are fine. I have a few of them. I have a WD red that is reporting surface errors, it’s still going and the number of errors hasn’t increased so I’m not stressing replacing it. Also, btrfs gives me peace of mind because I can periodiclly check if my filesystem has corrupted data.
About 3 hours.
It comes with three monkeys inside for redundancy:
At least it’s not a WD POS
I think if I needed to store 36TB of data, I would rather get several smaller disks.
That’s roughly what I have now, and I only have about 200gb left, so I kind of wish I could get a little more right now. This is across 7 drives. I really hope storing data becomes faster and cheaper in the future because as it keeps growing over the past few decades, it gets longer and longer to replace and move this much data…
Well, it does cost less and less every year. I bought two 8TB drives for $300 each or so, and today a 24TB drive is about that much.
SSDs are getting crazy cheap.
If you need 10tb of storage, you could get 2x used 10tb hdds in raid 1 for $200, but 6x used 2tb nvme in raid 5 is only $600 and 100x faster. Both take up the same amount of space.
Multiple drives in a RAID.
I don’t think the target audience of this drive is buying one. They are trying to optimize for density and are probably buying in bulk rather than paying the $800 price tag.
But if you hate your data there’s no quicker way to lose it than a single 36TB Seagate drive.
That’s why Seagate is the last word in the title.
But if you need a Petabyte of data you’ll appreciate this existing
Me who stores important data on seagate external HDD with no backup reading the comments roasting seagate:
Uh oh!!! Uh oh uh oh uh oh uh oh
Are people still mining chia ?
Great, can’t wait to afford it in 60 years.
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my qbittorrent is gonna love that
Imagine having that…then dropping it…
Summon Linus
That’s a lot of porn.
You’d go broke. Of course it’s all Linux, family archives and DNA test data, BTC blockchain, backed up FOSS projects, archives of Wikipedia, Project Gutenberg and OpenStreetMap, and of course - POVRay renders.
And linux distros
Werd
Just say it’s full of porn, it’s easier to explain
Depends on the audience tbh
Always keep an nsfw tab open to swap to so your family doesnt see you on the arch linux wiki.
Honestly, when I first got into forums, I thought they were literally talking about Linux distros, because at the time, that’s literally all I was seeding since that’s what I was into.
I have around 150 distros seeding 🤣. I need to get those numbers up!
You wouldn’t download your mom.
No, but I have downloaded yours.
I have seeded your mom.
bstix’s mom, has got it going on.
Is it worth replacing within a year only to be sent a refurbished when it dies?
Use redundancy. Don’t be a pleb.
